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News Carpenters: "The Vinyl Collection"

Discussion in 'A Song For You: The Carpenters Forum' started by Simon KC1950, Mar 28, 2017.

  1. CraigGA

    CraigGA Well-Known Member

    I have always said the song that puts me to sleep every time is When It's Gone. It goes on and on and on and on like a drone until it's gone. It is by far, the one I dislike the most. I think I might like BWAIL without the cliche orchestral swells. Those Good Old Dreams is another I tend to ignore, but endure it for its catchiness feeling. I just wish it had a more jazz feeling in the middle like And When He Smiles since other songs of the past are already borrowed from for it. I'm ok with Beechwood and Goofus. Jimmy Mac I could like if it wasn't too too high throughout the entire song. I wish I Just Fall In Love Again replaced When Its Gone on all the complications that use it.
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  2. GaryAlan

    GaryAlan Well-Known Member

    Now, If Karen Carpenter Solo were issued on Vinyl, that I would definitely purchase....
    fantasy bonus track....Something's Missing In My Life,
    please !

    On the issue of Beechwood 4-5789:
    I'll admit that it is a catchy song (as is its predecessor, Please Mr. Postman).
    However, compare/contrast the drum-work on these two songs.
    Whereas Karen's drumming on Postman complements the song,
    Ron Tutt overwhelms Beechwood with his drumming.
    Another point, I had not realized that Gayle Levant was "harping" in the song,
    until I read the credits I had not heard a harp in this song !
    So, in short, Karen's vocals are swamped by the mix/arrangement--thus, my dissatisfaction.
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  3. newvillefan

    newvillefan Well-Known Member


    I never knew that either, good spot! You can't even hear it on the recording though...
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  4. Chris May

    Chris May Resident 'Carpenterologist' Moderator

    Agreed 100%, and it's borderline uncomfortable to even listen to. Remember, we're talking about logistics and sweet spot here, so for those that want to rush to defend Karen, again this has zero to do with her skill and vocal ability and everything to do with poor material/key selection.
    Mark-T and Simon KC1950 like this.
  5. GaryAlan

    GaryAlan Well-Known Member

    ^^Agreed !
    However, I must add one caveat--
    The song "Now" is a very good song.
    But, the lead vocals (and the arrangement) are still too high and quite weak.
    Thus, I would add---
    and, I know I am completely at odds with Richard's assessment of "Now,"
    even though the material, the song itself, is good....
    the arrangement and the higher-key does not do this song justice....(IMHO).
    I always (that is, since 1983) felt "Now" was uncomfortable to listen to !
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  6. Jamesj75

    Jamesj75 Well-Known Member

    I'm enjoying this discussion overall and in particular with regard to "Now." I have always had mixed feelings about this song. Clearly a favorite of Richard's (as are "Sandy" and "Those Good Old Dreams"), it is touted as a tremendous vocal by Karen and some sort of revelation, as it was apparently Karen's last recording and made when she was in ill health. Of course, I realize the emotional impact of such a recording... Yet I agree that the key is too high. For me, "Now" is akin to "Sandy" and "Those Good Old Dreams": It is a pleasant enough album cut, but not a memorable, or regularly played, favorite of this fan.

    And getting back to the main theme of this thread, the only allure for me of a vinyl studio album box set would be in fulfillment of the role as completist.
    Jeff and Simon KC1950 like this.
  7. John Tkacik

    John Tkacik Active Member

    UMG and Richard would have to really sweeten the pot for me to bite on this one. I would want to see an "Offering" version of their first album and vinyl versions of "As Time Goes By", "Karen Carpenter", and "Pianist, Arranger, Composer, Conductor". Having second and third copies of the other vinyl US releases won't do it for me.
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  8. CraigGA

    CraigGA Well-Known Member

    I think we discovered earlier in the year that Jimmy Mac was abanded early on as a choice for the final project. I often wonder if this was going to be layered harmony throughout with a Temperton touch vocal mix. It is the only thing I can think of as to why it was so high. The same for Really You. It just hurts to listen to the chorus and how she kept it consistent without feeling tension is beyond me, so again, I think they were both unfinished or finished to the point of never wanting to be heard.
    Simon KC1950 and Mark-T like this.
  9. Chris May

    Chris May Resident 'Carpenterologist' Moderator

    I also agree with that! I was never a big fan of this track even though I know it was one of Karen's final recordings. I never cared for the range she sang it in, and her voice just sounds a bit thin on the low end for my liking - something I always just instinctively associated with her illness. May have just been that she wasn't as warmed up when she sang it (given the fact it was a work lead only).

    Either way, one I very rarely ever listen to.
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  10. Simon KC1950

    Simon KC1950 Member Thread Starter

    I would love to have the albums not released on vinyl before. I'm just thinking would 'As Time Goes By' require 2 LPs making it a double album?
    would it all fit on 1 LP ? Because it was put together thinking of CD not vinyl. If it was 2 LPs surly the second would be pretty empty... Maybe that's the perfect spot for Richard to add some new and unreleased material.
  11. Carpe diem

    Carpe diem Well-Known Member

    For me, it's really hard to listen to any recording from the duo post 1978. Now was Karen's swan song but I believe it went on too long. It's got a false ending...you think the song is over and then the chorus kicks in, and you basically have the same thing but, with a bit more production. Her vocals with Jimmy Mack are like all her vocals in this time frame. No emotional movement on the part of this listener. That is what I crave when I listen to Karen is the "OMG!" moment where I end up playing the song multiple times to somehow recapture that feeling. There was none of that in her solo album or MIA or VOTH. I do like Those Good Old Dreams as she has a certain "sweetness" in her vocals, the harmonies, the country-like sound of it and how it flows. Richard, at this point has lost his mojo; "The Carpenters" are no more. And it's evident that Karen's illness has had a significant negative impact on her voice. The rich contralto is gone...But to stay on topic, I can't wait to see what this vinyl box set is going to look like and the price :eek:!
    Simon KC1950 and Chris May like this.
  12. ScottyB

    ScottyB Active Member

    Def Leppard's "Hysteria" clocked in at 62:23 and Prefab Sprout's "Jordan: The Comeback" clocked in at 64:11. Both of these albums were issued on a single vinyl disc, so a single vinyl disc for "As Time Goes By" (at 63:07) is possible. The quality of the press? Well, that may be what would be determined.
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  13. GaryAlan

    GaryAlan Well-Known Member

    I greatly enjoy reading everyone's input !
    Another Vinyl LP idea:
    A double LP comprised of Karen's solo album and Richards instrumental album.
    That, would also be interesting.
    Karen's solo photo (althogh, not the VOH) on the album cover,
    and Richard's (the one on pacc) photo on back cover !
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  14. Simon KC1950

    Simon KC1950 Member Thread Starter

    That's interesting, I'd love the Solo albums to be included but I wouldn't be too disappointed if they do not appear in the box set because I can't imagine Richard including them.

    However, we know for a fact that Richard IS working on "New" material.
  15. tomswift2002

    tomswift2002 Active Member

    It would probably be close to the quality of the Carpenter's "Christmas Portrait" LP. That album contained nearly 30 minutes per side. As Rchard had been quoted on one occasion, Karen & him had packed that album to the limits in terms of how much vinyl could hold!
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  16. CraigGA

    CraigGA Well-Known Member

    I'm not sure I totally agree. Music, Music, Music was great with Make It Easy On Yourself and it came after 1978. I still think Karen had the right idea working with Rod Temperton but I feel Richard still needed to be involved. (I understand the reservations over the solo album, but I feel they were fixable. Some songs were very good, and some kinda stale apart from the Carpenters richness, which some fans probably would have expected.) Made In America was not their best but then there is Somebody's Been Lyin' which was good, but it was Melissa Manchester-ish. A Song For You, Rainy Days and Mondays, Yesterday Once More were the Carpenters unique sound that no one could touch, but many tried. But you can't sing the same type songs forever as unique artists. I feel they were unique. Life is sometimes heartbreaking for sure. That is why I try to focus on the best and find the good in every period, where possible. Their dedication and talent deserve it, plus, Karen's voice is still one of a kind.

    I have a feeling the vinyl set will go through Made In America, but who knows.
    ScottyB, Carpe diem and Simon KC1950 like this.
  17. David A

    David A Active Member

    I've read, as I am sure many of us have, that Karen was trying to "shed" somewhat, her deeper contralto voice toward the end of the 70's and explore her higher register. It's possible Richard keyed this song in a way he thought Karen would like to sing it. Her voice does sound "wispy" and whether that was intentional for the song interpretation or a sign of her illness, dunno.

    Nothing the the C's did after 1975 is in my top 12 or so favorites (Christmas songs aside), although there are many songs in the post '75 period I enjoy. I don't think that's a coincidence; as she moved away from her deep contralto magic, which melted me like the proverbial hot knife through butter. I missed that. However, this song is one of the one's I enjoy the most. I don't _think_ that's because of the emotional resonance of it being her last recorded song; maybe. I'm not inclined to introspection at the moment :wink: There's a plaintive sound in her voice that captures me.

    To stay on thread; I'd say again that while I totally get why many fans would not want "more of the same" on vinyl, for people like me who didn't save them, it's a Godsend. I _think_ there's enough people in my shoes - coupled with people who are just learning about the C's or are die-hard fans who will buy anything from them - that will make this a financial success. Hopefully there were will some things added that intrigue those who wouldn't otherwise buy this - that would cover all the potential consumers and provide the biggest fan reward and opportunity for financial success as well.
    Carpe diem and Simon KC1950 like this.
  18. Simon KC1950

    Simon KC1950 Member Thread Starter

    hopefully this is the start of a vinyl resurface with Richard Carpenter. I would love, as I'm sure every fan on here would, a singles box released internationally... I'm not talking about a cd one. I want a vinyl box set of 45's with their original picture sleeves. It could also mark the release of singles like Jambalaya in the US which us British fans already had. As a young fan I've obviously not been around to collect all the singles when they came out. I do have well over half of them but there are some that are hard to find for some reason.

    Could a vinyl box set of 45's ever be a possibility?
    Carpe diem likes this.
  19. Murray

    Murray Well-Known Member

    This set has the potential to be obscenely expensive. I'm almost hoping that there is no new material released as part of this set, because then I wouldn't feel any pressure to buy it. I still have all my original LPs, and they never get played as it is (I don't have a working turntable). It would kill me if I had to spend hundreds of dollars to get one or two new Karen tracks, and then have to buy a new turntable (or repair my old one) just to hear them!
    Carpe diem and Simon KC1950 like this.
  20. GaryAlan

    GaryAlan Well-Known Member

    I know the Vinyl LP
    sounds awesome.
    Now, what I fail to understand is the absence of any documentation regarding the terrific
    solo: Something's Missing In My Life.
    (Or, have I missed said documentation ? Perhaps it is given exposure in the Mook.)
    Why didn't anyone (Richard) jump on this song--
    complete it, orchestrate and mix it--whatever it takes.
    How has it lain dormant for so long ?
    As a completed project--vinyl or otherwise--
    how can this song miss ?
  21. Carpe diem

    Carpe diem Well-Known Member

    I think this box set is a good business move by Richard. The current vinyl record "resurgence" and the continued growth in popularity of The Carpenters especially in Asia (China, in particular), Australia, and Europe could be very lucrative for him. As Harry alluded to earlier in this thread, what about the "quality" of the product? If you shell out all this money, you want a nice product. Where is the manufacturing going to take place? Are they going to use "quality" materials? Are there going to be REAL quality control and testing measures present during the actual manufacturing process (what you got from Japan 35 yrs ago), or just paying it lip service (like you get from China now). I think a box of vinyl 45s could be a real possibility in the future, based on the success of the LPs. I would like to see that happen. One thing is for sure, if the price of the box set does not break your bank, the cost of a new turntable sure will. I'm still using my old Magnavox, manufactured in Malaysia in 1991.
    David A, Murray and Simon KC1950 like this.
  22. tomswift2002

    tomswift2002 Active Member

    I've seen new turntables at Wal-Mart for anywhere from $80 for a portable "suitcase" turntable with RCA outputs, all the way up to about $250 for one of those multi-purpose old-Fashioned-looking units that looks like a 1940's radio/turntable, but features turntable, AM/FM radio, cassette, CD-R and iPod/MP3 dock.

    But for a box set, it would be nice to get a vinyl box set in North America that featured all the 45's released from "Looking For Love" to "If I Had You", as well as "Something In Your Eyes" and other international singles like "Who Do You Love?", "Trying To Get The Feeling Again" and "The Rainbow Connection".
    Carpe diem and Simon KC1950 like this.
  23. Murray

    Murray Well-Known Member

    For the love of all that's holy, DO NOT buy a cheap Wal-Mart record shredder!!! Not if you want to preserve your vinyl investment, at least. A decent turntable / cartridge / stylus doesn't come cheap (unless you find a vintage one from a good brand at a thrift store and put in a new belt and stylus).

    Can you imagine how ticked off the people who payed thousands for an original Magic Lamp single would be? :laugh:
  24. tomswift2002

    tomswift2002 Active Member

    Well I've seen turntables from Crosely (for the suitcase style) to Sony at Walmart. Personally I wouldn't go for the multi-unit as it probably has the cheapest, if not a refurbished laser in it that will only wear out within a year.

    I've had a stand-alone Olympus turntable (with built in pre-amp) that I bought from Radio Shack about 13 years ago for about $150 and every year I change the cartridge on it so that I'm not damaging my vinyl with worn out needles.

    Well the original Magic Lamp would still be worth more than the reissues, since the reissues would be sourced from the masters made for "From The Top" that were sourced from ML 45. That 45 was still about 4 analog generations from the original mono masters (let's see: tape --- mono cutting master ---- negative/pressing master --- mono 45 positive), whereas a reissue would be a 5th analog generation made from a digital stereo master.
    Simon KC1950 likes this.
  25. newvillefan

    newvillefan Well-Known Member

    I've read and watched almost everything there is to do with the Carpenters and I've never read anywhere that Karen made a conscious effort to shed her lower register towards the end of the seventies.
    ScottyB, CraigGA and Simon KC1950 like this.

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