Horizon

I'd like to hear your opinions.

Why do you think Karen sounds so good on this album. I was listening to this in my car the other day. I bought a sealed LP awhile ago and burned it to a CDR, personally I think it sounds 100 x's better than any CD version I own.

I then re-read the fans Q/A that says:
I always heralded Horizon as my favorite Carpenters album. Why were there only ten songs?
Richard: I agree with the thought that the album should have had more material, and in fact " Tryin' to Get The Feeling Again" was cut for it. In retrospect this should have been included, however I felt there were too many ballads. Karen and I were overbooked and low on energy. Our touring schedule was really unrealistic, and by September we ended up with Karen, already struggling with anorexia nervosa, in the hospital. We postponed two major tours, the European and the Japanese. At this time most albums by major artists had included ten songs anyway. Despite all this, Horizon is impeccably produced, with Karen never singing and sounding better and the album brilliantly engineered by the late Roger Young.


The opinions I'd like to hear are in regard to how was Richard able to get Karen to sound so amazing on this album. For me she sounds so different (but in a good way) I swear that Solitaire is just perfection, the way it builds to the middle and then gets better, the chorus is almost hypnotic for me toward the end. Was it just the time in Karen's like that she could do this or was it the material being melancholy or was it the recording studio or a different mic used by Karen.

It's funny how Richard says that Trying to Get the Feeling was suppose to be included cause when you hear that (although it was a work lead) Karen has "THAT" same Horizon sound and I could see that song fitting right in with not only the theme of the album but the way she sounded as a whole.

What do you think?

I agree, Horizon is amazing. Wish there were more tracks on it. Although "Trying" was cut for the album, I always thought "Ordinary Fool" would have been a better complement to the rest of the songs. If I remember correctly, "Only Yesterday" is the only other song besides "Postman" to include horns or woodwinds. Ordinary Fool could have brought a nice balance. For those interested, my review of Horizon is at http://insightsandsounds.blogspot.com/2009/02/horizon-review-carpenters-masterpiece.html.

They also were able to use 48 tracks too, right? Maybe that's what gave it THAT sound!!

At that point, only 24 tracks of recording were possible. It later became possible to chain two together to make 48 analog tracks but this wasn't possible in 1975.

Ed

Sorry, that's what I meant....24 tracks.

according to Carpenters Fan Club Newsletter #42 in the bio re: Tony Peluso - " Tony has recently written 2 songs, Sailing On The Tide and Happy. Both songs will be on Carpenters new album. " I remember reading that and was wondering why "Sailing On The Tide" wasn't on the LP when I got it.

This is such a buoyant, upbeat tune that this would have truly balanced the somber but brilliant "Horizon". I am going to include this on my next CDR while adding "Trying To Get The Feeling" to the "Horizon" chronological order.

As for the bookended "Aurora" and "Eventide" - they ARE BEAUTIFUL - but I never really considered them as "songs" and when "Eventide" finished after the first listening - I felt like I was waiting for more. And we had been waiting (selfishly) for new Carpenter product and all we got were EIGHT really polished pieces!. . . .Hence - "Trying To Get The Feeling" and "Sailing On The Tide" were MAYBE the pieces I was probably looking for !
Just my thoughts -

Quick question - where was it discovered that "Ordinary Fool" was recorded during the HORIZON sessions? Thanks in advance

I agree that the vinyl sounds better than the CDs that I own. I love vinyl....

I also have always thought that Karen never sounded better than on Horizon. Just the other day I was wondering what types of mics were used on that album.....such a different sound than the albums before and after. To me there is such a presence....and a thick, warm tone....

Very different sound than say, on Made in America.....I love some of the songs on that album, but they have such thin sounding vocals.....maybe just the mics used????
jonathan

I love this album from cover to cover. What I find most intriguing is that...except for the 'stamped' decal identifying both artist and album title, it is nameless. I wonder if there was a message in that.

FYI- "Ordinary Fool" was recorded in 1976, from what I remember. It could have been on included on Hush.

Flashback to '69 and follow Karen's voice thru-out and studio aside she had matured far beyond Rainy Days and A Song For You. She was at her peak during HORIZON and with the exception of CHRISTMAS PORTRAIT I hear a steady thinning of the vocals from then on. When I want to be enveloped by Karen Carpenter I listen to the HORIZON recording sessions. Yes the lp was a bit draggy but Karen shines as a vocalist and shows a glimmer of where good health and wellness would've taken her.

Jeff

I love Christmas Portrait too......it sounds the closest to Horizon.....

As much as I love 'Made In America', I have always thought the quality of Karen's vocals is not as warm, full and rich as it is on say, Horizon. I think that comes down to three factors:

1. Karen's voice had matured, but also thinned due perhaps to her illness.
2. The microphones used may not have been the same.
3. The mastering of the album is not as good (despite it being the most expensive non-Christmas album they made).

BUT: the big contradiction to #1 and #2 is that, if you listen to an outtake like 'The Uninvited Guest', compared to a track from the finished album like 'Somebody's Been Lying', there's a world of difference.

What I'm trying to say, is that I think on 'The Uninvited Guest', that warm, rich vocal is back, in fact it probably was there all along, but I think the final recordings mixed and sweetened on MIA don't convey this quality. I think it's a problem with the overall album. It's at it's most prevalent on '(Want You) Back In My Life Again', where Karen's voice is the thinnest and lightest I have ever heard her sound.

^^ In my opinion, MIA was the Carps struggling for a hit- and being willing to do whatever it took to get one.

??? Let down? Overproduced? No way. HORIZON is my all-time Carpenters favorite. It's all about reverb. Echo. Yeah! You're right, though. Karen's voice had matured, and technology was definitely on her side as well.

And as for Richard, [I'm certain that he would agree] his wizardry was all over the place with the arrangement of HORIZON, including some BGVs... with the exception of "I Can Dream, Can't I", which he apparently had nothing to do with, according to the credits. Billy May? Talk about a head switch after "Postman"! Anyway, Richard does sing very well in his own right, but as he admitted himself, "Karen is clearly the star". And this proves it conclusively in my book.

Tony

Horizon isn't one of my favourites, although it's indoubtedly a great album. It seems to lack some kind of sparkle for me that was there on the previous albums. Some adjectives that come to mind are 'dreamy', 'laboured', 'sluggish'. 'A Kind Of Hush' saw them slump even further into this state.

Why Richard felt the need to put '(Caught Between) Goodbye and I Love You' and 'Love Me For What I Am' back to back is beyond me, they're far too similar, almost sister songs. I'd love to have seen 'Trying To Get The Feeling Again' close the album just before 'Eventide'.

I'll add my voice to those who feel that HORIZON was a bit of a let-down. I've always felt that HORIZON marked the beginning of the loss of energy (for lack of a better word) from Karen and Richard's albums. It felt, well, tired.

Part of the "tiredness" comes from the tempo of the songs -- there are a lot of slow ballads here. Part comes from the brevity of the album (only eight "real" songs plus the bookend pieces). Part of it comes from the production (lack of large-scale overdubbing). And part of it comes from the songwriting (most of the songs just don't "grab" me).

Yes, I think that Karen sounds magnificent here. But I wish there had been better material for her to sing.

David

Love hearing the different opinions- even though I disagree...