Of course it’s been talked about at length, but after hearing the album today after a while, and after a month of hearing their Christmas albums, it’s staggering to hear how different Karen sounds on this with the direct contrast. I don’t even know if it’s the usual criticism that her voice is buried in the mix so much as her vocal quality is diminished some after the ipecac abuse. The richness and spark found on CP and before sound absent for the most part - perhaps the former a physiological reason and the latter a psychological one.
⭐ Official Review [Album]: "MADE IN AMERICA" (SP-3723)
- Thread starter Chris May
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There’s a thinner tone, but she sounds more emotionally involved in the solo performances even if the arrangements aren’t up to par.
CraigGA
Well-Known Member
The live performances in YouTube from 1974 are amazing. There is a natural strength that even rivals the polished recordings of the same time. It’s the Made In America tour that the live performance is heartbreaking in comparison. The 1980 Music Music Music performance on TV are still very moving.
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I believe it. We've all heard the line that the disease didn't affect her voice but it most certainly did later. It definitely became more fragile and lighter as the disease progressed. She could still hit the notes but by "Now," it was incredibly fragile. It makes total sense why it would be too.
Ed
That whole MIA tour needs to be erased from everyone’s collective memory in the performative sense, but remembered as an essential part in understanding what was really going on in the personal sense.
Her vocal quality on the MMM performances sound much richer and classic than a chunk of the ones that ended up on MIA.
Not to mention, she clearly lacked the ability to project by this stage, which was likely more noticeable given the fact that Karen didn't sing loudly to begin with. Certainly some of the warmth was missing by this stage as well, and at one point in the France performance, she's actually singing flat in one or two places.
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Agreed. You can hear the fader move on Karen's solo "Make Believe It's Your First Time." during the line "we'll take our time with love the way...it oughta BE." The engineer-assisted volume increase tells us all we need to know about how Anorexia affects the person's ability to amplify their voices.
Ed
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
So if we acknowledge that her illness affected her vocal ability where does that leave us? The outcome is still same…she can no longer sing for us. We cannot erase or change history. We have to accept what we have been given even though it may not be what we like.
Mark-T
Well-Known Member
I wonder if the poor 1981 France performance was the result of extra stress and perhaps different choices by her tied to her illness. The reason I say this is in 1982 during the last sessions, she still sounds pretty rich and much like the old Karen.
I’m sure exhaustion had much to do with it. But in the recordings from April ‘82, I still feel Karen didn’t sound completely like the Karen from a few years earlier. Don’t get me wrong, she still sounded GREAT, but her voice always sounded thinner to me on these, regardless of whether or not they were not master leads.
No one here is shaming her for not sounding her old self, rather it’s interesting from a physiological standpoint to hear what changed and why. No ones being negative or hurtful to her memory for talking about something that can very much be heard as a result of what physically happened to she and vocal chords.
She doesn’t sound “faulty” but I think the warm timbre isn’t how it was say on the Tan Album. I think by 1982 her spirit was already fading, it seems like she didn’t care about singing at that time, her interior drama was overwhelming any external desire to be a performer.
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I didn't get the sense on the later stuff that she wasn't into it. Karen was Karen; with rare exception, she was into it. That's just how incredible she was. To my ears, her instrument had begun to let her down. As @Chris May said, her voice had become quite fragile and she just couldn't project anymore. This is especially true of "Now." It's not my thing because it's just so completely "elevator" but she totally sells it. I utterly believe her. That's no the issue for me at all.
Ed
On the 82 tracks she doesn’t sound anywhere near as invested in the stuff as just a few years before, and how could anyone expect her to? The last few years had been the worst of a life which must have felt cursed for her, she was as sickly and emotionally as miserable as ever. Now she’s cutting these forgettable, sugary sweet Disney-like songs with zero potential. In a way these two final cuts were the final tragically poetic daggers; she was never going to escape what she was told her lot in life was meant to be.
GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
I have always found it interesting that I Believe You, recorded in 1978,
sounds vocally as if it were recorded in the same time-frame as the other Made In America songs.
In other words, even compared to other 1978 recordings (say: Where Do I Go From Here or Little Altar Boy),
I Believe You sounds as if it belongs to another period (MIA) and not to that 1978 time period.
Karen's vocals changed even within the earlier periods, not necessarily only later (say 1981 or 1982) years.
The evidence of physical--that is, vocally--changes throughout the years is there for all to hear in the "live" performances.
Studio manipulation (engineering, mixing, or otherwise) can only do so much to compensate.
sounds vocally as if it were recorded in the same time-frame as the other Made In America songs.
In other words, even compared to other 1978 recordings (say: Where Do I Go From Here or Little Altar Boy),
I Believe You sounds as if it belongs to another period (MIA) and not to that 1978 time period.
Karen's vocals changed even within the earlier periods, not necessarily only later (say 1981 or 1982) years.
The evidence of physical--that is, vocally--changes throughout the years is there for all to hear in the "live" performances.
Studio manipulation (engineering, mixing, or otherwise) can only do so much to compensate.
tomswift2002
Well-Known Member
“Now” was a terrible song for her to record. It was way too high and Karen sounds incredible airy and is straining to reach those high notes. She was using too much falsetto. But “You’re Enough”, which is clearly the better of the two, is the very opposite and Karen’s voice sounds better on it.
3Favorites
Active Member
Couldn't disagree more! 
I love Now. Beautiful lyrics, lovely melody, flawless vocal. I remember on the day VOH was release and my hearing this song, my first thought was "Karen did herself proud. Feel the same about Make Believe It's Your First Time and Look to Your Dreams. Three of my all time favorites.
As for Made In America,...I do like it. But then I then I like them all. Just some songs more than others. And I have never skipped a song ever! I look forward to certain songs, but I always wait for their turn to play.
After reading this forum for awhile, I came to listen to this album last night with new ears. I noticed that the voice was softer, quieter on Strength of a Woman, and Back In your Life Again. Like maybe they needed more compression or EQ or something to bring her voice out more.
I think that Touch Me When We're Dancing, Those Good All Dreams and You've Got It would have been my choices for singles.
Because We Are In Love has a beautiful, Standards kind of feeling and Karen's voice is really marvelous at the end especially. But I don't think it would work as a single. But then most of the others didn't either.
I don't think it was any song choice that ended their hit streak. I think it was the same thing that happens to most artists. They are popular for a time, and then sometimes...over night...they can't give a song away. I think that at this point in their career, almost any song they would have done would struggled to make it to the charts.
I love Now. Beautiful lyrics, lovely melody, flawless vocal. I remember on the day VOH was release and my hearing this song, my first thought was "Karen did herself proud. Feel the same about Make Believe It's Your First Time and Look to Your Dreams. Three of my all time favorites.As for Made In America,...I do like it. But then I then I like them all. Just some songs more than others. And I have never skipped a song ever! I look forward to certain songs, but I always wait for their turn to play.
After reading this forum for awhile, I came to listen to this album last night with new ears. I noticed that the voice was softer, quieter on Strength of a Woman, and Back In your Life Again. Like maybe they needed more compression or EQ or something to bring her voice out more.
I think that Touch Me When We're Dancing, Those Good All Dreams and You've Got It would have been my choices for singles.
Because We Are In Love has a beautiful, Standards kind of feeling and Karen's voice is really marvelous at the end especially. But I don't think it would work as a single. But then most of the others didn't either.
I don't think it was any song choice that ended their hit streak. I think it was the same thing that happens to most artists. They are popular for a time, and then sometimes...over night...they can't give a song away. I think that at this point in their career, almost any song they would have done would struggled to make it to the charts.
Another Son
Well-Known Member
I’ve always loved ‘Now’ and still do and it’s always been to do with the song and Karen’s performance. I didn’t even know that it was her last recording until later years. That has nothing to do with my love of the track, for me.
The first time I listened to ‘Made in America’ back in 1981, I noticed that Karen’s voice, on some tracks, didn’t have the strength that it had on earlier recordings. It was that obvious.
However, her ultra-appealing warm, deeper tones are still just as beautiful as ever on tracks such as Those Good Old Dreams, When You’ve Got What It Takes, Somebody’s Been Lying, When It’s Gone and Because We Are in Love, so there’s still plenty to love on the album.
To me, on ‘Made in America’, Karen also sounds absolutely heavenly in her higher register in the high parts of songs like Because We Are in Love, so THAT beauty is also there. On some other songs, her voice does sound weak and strained in the higher sections.
For me, the solo album is a different story. To my ear, the beautiful quality of Karen’s voice just isn’t picked up on most of the lead vocals. I don’t really like the way she sounds. Whether that’s because of the fact that most songs don’t make use of her lower register, because of the way she’s performing or because of the way she’s produced and recorded, I’m not sure. I think it’s all of the above, actually. Her voice is certainly thinner and more nasal on the album. However, her background vocals are brilliant, in many places.
I think the way Karen sounds on the later recordings is also partly to do with a stylistic choice. She certainly sings very, very softly on parts of the Music, Music, Music special - take the background vocals on the Hits medley as a case in point. She also seems to choose to sing in this style on a number of other recordings, from that time on. She almost whispers throughout Back In My Life Again, for example. This could have been a calculated choice and would have had to have been worked out between engineer, producer and performer.
Something to consider about annorexia is that the person with it is quite ‘out of it’ a lot of the time. Their blood sugar is low, their head is spinning and they may often feel dizzy. Their thoughts may be disjointed and they may not be able to think their way through everyday situations. The body also kicks in for survival by releasing various chemicals, producing a natural high. Add to that the effects of various non-prescription and prescription medications that Karen is said to have been taking around 1981 and it seems that she really wouldn’t have been in a very fit condition to be standing on a stage in front of a camera and performing, at all, during those televised live performances.
Even so, to look at this from a selfish point of view, incredibly, Karen still delivered a lot of amazingly beautiful performances and recordings throughout this time that she was suffering so badly, which we are able to treasure, always. That’s an amazing testament to her spirit and talent.
The first time I listened to ‘Made in America’ back in 1981, I noticed that Karen’s voice, on some tracks, didn’t have the strength that it had on earlier recordings. It was that obvious.
However, her ultra-appealing warm, deeper tones are still just as beautiful as ever on tracks such as Those Good Old Dreams, When You’ve Got What It Takes, Somebody’s Been Lying, When It’s Gone and Because We Are in Love, so there’s still plenty to love on the album.
To me, on ‘Made in America’, Karen also sounds absolutely heavenly in her higher register in the high parts of songs like Because We Are in Love, so THAT beauty is also there. On some other songs, her voice does sound weak and strained in the higher sections.
For me, the solo album is a different story. To my ear, the beautiful quality of Karen’s voice just isn’t picked up on most of the lead vocals. I don’t really like the way she sounds. Whether that’s because of the fact that most songs don’t make use of her lower register, because of the way she’s performing or because of the way she’s produced and recorded, I’m not sure. I think it’s all of the above, actually. Her voice is certainly thinner and more nasal on the album. However, her background vocals are brilliant, in many places.
I think the way Karen sounds on the later recordings is also partly to do with a stylistic choice. She certainly sings very, very softly on parts of the Music, Music, Music special - take the background vocals on the Hits medley as a case in point. She also seems to choose to sing in this style on a number of other recordings, from that time on. She almost whispers throughout Back In My Life Again, for example. This could have been a calculated choice and would have had to have been worked out between engineer, producer and performer.
Something to consider about annorexia is that the person with it is quite ‘out of it’ a lot of the time. Their blood sugar is low, their head is spinning and they may often feel dizzy. Their thoughts may be disjointed and they may not be able to think their way through everyday situations. The body also kicks in for survival by releasing various chemicals, producing a natural high. Add to that the effects of various non-prescription and prescription medications that Karen is said to have been taking around 1981 and it seems that she really wouldn’t have been in a very fit condition to be standing on a stage in front of a camera and performing, at all, during those televised live performances.
Even so, to look at this from a selfish point of view, incredibly, Karen still delivered a lot of amazingly beautiful performances and recordings throughout this time that she was suffering so badly, which we are able to treasure, always. That’s an amazing testament to her spirit and talent.
3Favorites
Active Member
I'm also sure that I didn't know that Now was the last song Keren recorded until later. I just know the first time I heard it that I knew it was magic.
And I agree with Another Son. I think some of the changes we hear in her voice were choices that she consciously made. I'm sure she sang the way she thought she sounded the best. I remember reading somewhere that Richard said she always wanted to re-record SOMEDAY and then she finally got the chance for one of their specials. And I know I certainly liked how it came out.
I wish they would release all their specials. Didn't have recorders back then. And their TV show too!
And I agree with Another Son. I think some of the changes we hear in her voice were choices that she consciously made. I'm sure she sang the way she thought she sounded the best. I remember reading somewhere that Richard said she always wanted to re-record SOMEDAY and then she finally got the chance for one of their specials. And I know I certainly liked how it came out.
I wish they would release all their specials. Didn't have recorders back then. And their TV show too!
Another Son
Well-Known Member
Karen also revelled in re-recording the snippet of ‘A Song for You’ in 1980, on ‘Music, Music, Music’. She finally got to totally nail that lowest note in ‘A Song for You’ that she didn’t get convincingly on the album, due to the nodules on the vocal cords / laryngitis that plagued her during the recording of the set in 1972.
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I'm listening again now as I type this and it really is pretty stark. She sounds somewhat frail on "Now." Of course, she's Karen so it sounds very nice. "You're Enough" sounds far more confident and her tone is utterly intact her. "Now" forces her to higher place in her voice and she just wasn't as good there. There are lots of nice low notes for Karen to luxuriate in on "You're Enough" and it makes all the difference, IMHO.
Ed
Another Son
Well-Known Member
‘..knew it was magic ....’ ... That’s the perfect way to put it, 3Favorites. I felt the same thing when I first heard ‘Now’, and still do.
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