I forgot about Scott and Veronique. The sad thing about it is that the ONLY worthwhile thing out of those projects was Old Fashioned Christmas. All the rest were wastes of time as far I'm concerned; his solo album was garbage (When Time WAWH was a small standout), Scott Grimes shouldn't have ever been a "thing", Veronique's album sounds stiff and bland today, and the KC Story was so empty and devoid of substance even for a TV movie. But yet I wonder if he had started LL right after OFC it may have sounded very different and not as carefully crafted or with different arrangements etc.
⭐ Official Review [Album]: "LOVELINES" (SP-3931)
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I forgot about Scott and Veronique. The sad thing about it is that the ONLY worthwhile thing out of those projects was Old Fashioned Christmas. All the rest were wastes of time as far I'm concerned; his solo album was garbage (When Time WAWH was a small standout), Scott Grimes shouldn't have ever been a "thing", Veronique's album sounds stiff and bland today, and the KC Story was so empty and devoid of substance even for a TV movie. But yet I wonder if he had started LL right after OFC it may have sounded very different and not as carefully crafted or with different arrangements etc.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
I forgot to mention the other big distraction in his personal life: raising his young family.
It definitely wouldn’t have been the same album if he’d released it in 1984 or 1985. Her death was still only very recent, his grief obviously still raw and for that reason I think the arrangements and the overall feel of the album would have been as melancholic as VOTH and AOFC. For me, Lovelines was the right album at the right time. It sort of tied in with the TV movie as it was a vehicle to include the two previously unreleased tracks from it and six years on, his views on the solo album had obviously mellowed enough for him to include the best four to suit the style of the album.
GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
Billboard did help to promote the album:
Recommended, Billboard Magazine, December 9, 1989, page 72:
THE CARPENTERS
Lovelines
PRODUCERS: Richard Carpenter; Phil Ramone
A & M 13931
"This collection of unreleased tunes is amassed from Karen Carpenter's
sessions with Phil Ramone and songs recorded by the brother and sister act
over the years. One listen and it's clear that no one -the closest is Gloria Estefan -
has filled the void left after Karen's death in 1983. There's a good reason why some of
the syrupy material was never released, but other tracks, like first single "If I Had You,"
the classic "When I Fall In Love," and "Where Do I Go From Here," instantly recall
why the duo was one of the most successful of the '70s."
Paul grein, Billboard Magazine, November 25, 1989:
"And in the better -late- than -never department, Karen Carpenter has the week's Hot Shot Debut on the
Hot Adult Contemporary chart with "If I Had You," a track from a solo album she recorded a decade ago
with Grammy- winning producer Phil Ramone. The album was completed in early 1980, but was never released.
Carpenter died three years later. "If I Had You" is one of four tracks from the solo project included
on a new Carpenters album, "Lovelines."
Recommended, Billboard Magazine, December 9, 1989, page 72:
THE CARPENTERS
Lovelines
PRODUCERS: Richard Carpenter; Phil Ramone
A & M 13931
"This collection of unreleased tunes is amassed from Karen Carpenter's
sessions with Phil Ramone and songs recorded by the brother and sister act
over the years. One listen and it's clear that no one -the closest is Gloria Estefan -
has filled the void left after Karen's death in 1983. There's a good reason why some of
the syrupy material was never released, but other tracks, like first single "If I Had You,"
the classic "When I Fall In Love," and "Where Do I Go From Here," instantly recall
why the duo was one of the most successful of the '70s."
Paul grein, Billboard Magazine, November 25, 1989:
"And in the better -late- than -never department, Karen Carpenter has the week's Hot Shot Debut on the
Hot Adult Contemporary chart with "If I Had You," a track from a solo album she recorded a decade ago
with Grammy- winning producer Phil Ramone. The album was completed in early 1980, but was never released.
Carpenter died three years later. "If I Had You" is one of four tracks from the solo project included
on a new Carpenters album, "Lovelines."
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
Once again, two more reviews singling this track out for praise. I maintain to this day that If I Had You should have been released to test the waters back in 1980 if they were so unsure about the album, and that the track would have been a big hit.
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
Yup you can’t tell me they didn’t hear hit single material on payback for that song. It’s no wonder the east coast was happy while the west coast was nervous of what might happen if this turned into a hit for Karen.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
The East coast team were probably ecstatic because the track, like a few others on the album, has a real New York vibe to it, right down to the sax solo. Very contemporary production for its time. A&M were right to be nervous. I’ve long harboured a deep suspicion that there was a concerted effort to vote the album down because they knew it would be successful and were fearful of the damage that have done to the Carpenters as a brand.
Vinylalbumcovers
Ah am so steel een luv weeth yoo
I agree. It’s the most Carpenter-like thing on the record so it wouldn’t have scared fans off but it still sounds of its time. If anything would have worked, this tune might have.
Ed
Vinylalbumcovers
Ah am so steel een luv weeth yoo
If that record happens, Richard is lost. It’s really that simple. I’d never speculate on whether or not Richard wanted that to happen but that fact is inescapable.
Ed
tomswift2002
Well-Known Member
You forgot the Akiko album.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
Well pardon me
When you consider Richard’s relationship with Herb and Jerry and the fact he was the brains behind one of A&M’s cash cows...it’s not hard to work it out.
Proudofyou
Well-Known Member
I remembering listening to an interview with John Bettis (it's on Youtube) and he said something like, "Look, if LA thought they had another Saturday Night Fever, blockbuster seller, trust me they would have released it." I mean who knows at this point, but I thought that was interesting. And maybe it's kinda true. If the label saw big smash, Richard wouldn't have a say. (not to infer that I don't like the album. Some of the tracks are fantastic).
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
I think you’re referring to the interview with Chris May. In it he did say that the label would have overridden Richard if they thought it was a smash. The point is, I don’t think anyone on this forum would agree it would be another Saturday Night Fever, that’s a gross exaggeration of the truth and yet another attempt to close ranks and deflect attention away from the reason for its cancellation: that it would have been a moderately successful album.
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
A Big Pardon that is too.. lol how could you forget that one Stephen? For me as far as best.... Akiko’s comes right after AOFC.Well pardon me
.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
I agree Stephen, sorry but we all know it would never be a Saturday Night Fever album...why couldn’t it have just been Karen’s album. Why compare it against something like that? A part of me hurts when I hear stuff like that...it’s like still telling Karen “it’s not good enough” in a round a bout way.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
I may have hijacked this thread and I apologise. Let’s not turn it into another KC solo album thread. Can I just say, all things considered, Lovelines is one hell of an album. Aside from A Song For You, it’s the only one I regularly listen to from start to finish for pure listening enjoyment. The fact it’s a pot pourri of album tracks released posthumously makes it even more impressive. I bought it in 1990 when feverishly gobbling up their catalogue as a new fan without realising its place in their recording history and just thought all their other albums would sound like this. It’s so sophisticated.
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
Right Stephen...you know how easily we get distracted around here...thank you for bringing us back on topic oh and I see you finally know your name.
oh and I see you finally know your name. I wasn't even born yet but it's crazy that the last "regular" Carpenters album was released thirty years ago this October. Where does time go? This is a random thought/story, but I was watching the movie Sixteen Candles last year (it's a favorite that I watch every year) which was out in 1984, and I was thinking how I love how drenched in mid-80s culture it was - fashion, music, look, sounds, etc I loved that (like many movies of that time) it looks "dated" today but in a good fascinating time capsule kind of way. I was thinking how much has changed since that year, how this time existed so far back, and that Karen had died a year earlier, making her death seem so far long ago; an even older occurrence than the making of this movie that many people reflect back on in 2019 with a wistful nostalgia. It's such a weird train of thought but I had Karen in mind because the years were beside each other, and yet she wasn't around to live in 1984 and beyond, to see how the world developed.
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
That's funny you bring up that movie, Sixteen Candles, it was a hilarious and the chemistry between Sam and Jake...well they didn't have enough scenes together...I guess that's what made it work. I love the hit song from The Thompson Twins, "If You Were Here" I have this on a Cd called VH1: The Big 80's-The Big Movies. It contains all these awesome 80's hit songs from movies, like "Pretty In Pink" The Psychedelic Furs (another Molly movie) "If You Leave" Orchestral Manoeuvers In The Dark, "Don't You (Forget About Me)" Simple Minds and "You Might Think" The Cars....I love the 80's music.
I think the lack of screen time they share is a benefit in the end, and it works that both characters are interesting and very well played when we see them separately, both trying to find happiness on two far apart ends of the high school hierarchy. And the movie itself has an awesome soundtrack, even for songs that only appear for a few seconds but are used to great emotional effect. Hughes knew what he was doing from his first film. You wonder if Karen would have gone into these mainstream 80s pop songs, the likes you hear in this. She had a voice that maybe didn't match the hard edged stuff (she didn't have a "rock voice"), but imagine her covering a song like True by Spandau Ballet (heard in the dance scene). A great song as is, but I can imagine many ballads she could have sang with a contemporary 80s flavor that also used her lower register, and True would have been a great cover.
GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
The song, Kiss Me The Way You Did Last Night,
Wow ! What a production ! Richard Carpenter writes: "one of my favorites."
Given that the background vocals are complete,
was this song completed as we hear it on this album, already in 1981 ?
A song of that caliber which appears on NO other compilation--only on Lovelines album.
Wow ! What a production ! Richard Carpenter writes: "one of my favorites."
Given that the background vocals are complete,
was this song completed as we hear it on this album, already in 1981 ?
A song of that caliber which appears on NO other compilation--only on Lovelines album.
tomswift2002
Well-Known Member
Considering that Lovelines turns 30 in a few days (October 31, 1989), I was playing this in my truck today. I bought Lovelines on CD during the summer of 1999.
“If I Had You” is the stand-out track on this album. No wonder it hit #18 on the Adult Contemporary chart, and has shown up on 4 compilation albums. And the cold ending is better than the solo album version. I first heard this on the Canadian cassette of Interpretations, which I bought on October 31, 1997 (it was a PA day, and this was my Halloween treat) which I later returned to the store (since Side 1 went crazy, sounding like it was stretching, after only like 28 days, but Side 2 played fine, which even the store staff couldn’t figure out) and upgraded to the CD. And for Halloween 1997, “If I Had You” was the TOP track of Interpretations.
“The Uninvited Guest” was also a good B-side for Halloween. It’s to bad that this song hasn’t been anthologized more than it’s one appearance on the PBS Singles Collection.
“Lovelines” the song, is a great opening track, both here and on Karen’s solo album. This is probably the only track from Lovelines that has not been anthologized, since the 2006 Japanese Singles Box stopped with “Honolulu City Lights” in 1986, rather than going onto “If I Had You” which had “Lovelines” as its B-side in Japan. (The solo version of this song is on the NL Ultimate Collection/Collected).
Other stand-out tracks from this album are: “Honolulu City Light”, “Slow Dance”, “Remember When Loving Took All Night”, “When I Fall In Love” and “Kiss Me The Way You Did Last Night”.
“Little Girl Blue” I also first heard on Interpretations. Really there I would’ve preferred another track like “Honolulu City Lights”, since it’s not that interesting of a song. It would’ve been better had “Still Crazy After All These Years” or “My Body Keeps Changing My Mind” closed the album.
Otherwise the other tracks are nice album cuts, but they feel like too much like “Strength of a Woman” or “I Believe You” from MIA.
“If I Had You” is the stand-out track on this album. No wonder it hit #18 on the Adult Contemporary chart, and has shown up on 4 compilation albums. And the cold ending is better than the solo album version. I first heard this on the Canadian cassette of Interpretations, which I bought on October 31, 1997 (it was a PA day, and this was my Halloween treat) which I later returned to the store (since Side 1 went crazy, sounding like it was stretching, after only like 28 days, but Side 2 played fine, which even the store staff couldn’t figure out) and upgraded to the CD. And for Halloween 1997, “If I Had You” was the TOP track of Interpretations.
“The Uninvited Guest” was also a good B-side for Halloween. It’s to bad that this song hasn’t been anthologized more than it’s one appearance on the PBS Singles Collection.
“Lovelines” the song, is a great opening track, both here and on Karen’s solo album. This is probably the only track from Lovelines that has not been anthologized, since the 2006 Japanese Singles Box stopped with “Honolulu City Lights” in 1986, rather than going onto “If I Had You” which had “Lovelines” as its B-side in Japan. (The solo version of this song is on the NL Ultimate Collection/Collected).
Other stand-out tracks from this album are: “Honolulu City Light”, “Slow Dance”, “Remember When Loving Took All Night”, “When I Fall In Love” and “Kiss Me The Way You Did Last Night”.
“Little Girl Blue” I also first heard on Interpretations. Really there I would’ve preferred another track like “Honolulu City Lights”, since it’s not that interesting of a song. It would’ve been better had “Still Crazy After All These Years” or “My Body Keeps Changing My Mind” closed the album.
Otherwise the other tracks are nice album cuts, but they feel like too much like “Strength of a Woman” or “I Believe You” from MIA.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
The latter almost did make it onto the tracklist, replaces at the last minute by Remember When Lovin’ Took All Night.
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