BarryT60
Well-Known Member
I wasn't aware she had even started Auld Lang Syne.... Would love to hear even a line or two - if she had done a snippet... so many unheard snippets... :*(
carpenter Golden Years 1970 to 1975
- Thread starter adam
- Start date
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
I think Richard is too serious and analytical to appear on a show like that. He's much better suited to documentaries and other shows of a more serious, in-depth nature.
Buried Alien
Active Member
It would have been interesting to see how the Carpenters' sound would have evolved through the 80s, 90s, and new millennium had Karen survived and she and Richard continued working together up to the present day. The two were never followers of trends, but I'm sure they would have evolved...just not sure how.
I am note afraid to lay the blame for a lot of their problems at jerry Weintraub's feet. he took them in a direction that clearly did not benefit them. television specials would have been a good thing for them if it had been done in a more adult fashion. Weintraub had to have known that everyone thought they were a grown up Donny & Marie. Karen should have been put out their in a sparkly cocktail dress instead of those virgin mary dresses and overalls with striped sox. Richard just needed a bit of coaching and training to come across friendlier and more approachable.
health issue aside, I think they could have made their way back. akoh should have never been released. herb alpert even asked Richard if he was sure about it. Richard was trying, in his own way, to move forward with their sound. there was no reason to lose the ballads, but some the mia tracks were misses, but obviously he stepped into the unknown trying to keep them relevant in a changing market. as I have said before, I do believe IN LOVE ALONE, from his solo album, would have put them back on the international charts, and a respectable showing here at home.
health issue aside, I think they could have made their way back. akoh should have never been released. herb alpert even asked Richard if he was sure about it. Richard was trying, in his own way, to move forward with their sound. there was no reason to lose the ballads, but some the mia tracks were misses, but obviously he stepped into the unknown trying to keep them relevant in a changing market. as I have said before, I do believe IN LOVE ALONE, from his solo album, would have put them back on the international charts, and a respectable showing here at home.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
I'm on holiday in Vegas this week and Donny and Marie have the biggest billboard advertisement on the strip. Family entertainment from sibling performers both in their 50s. In another time, another place, maybe this could have been Richard and Karen.
Jamesj75
Well-Known Member
I thoroughly enjoyed your post, Actorman. And I agree with you on this last point. But I would add that, even with the way things have transpired, you could make a case that they have become "cool again" from time to time. Cool enough to be honored with a tribute album. Cool enough to continue adding to their sales in a variety of countries. Cool enough to garner a gold album for Love Songs and the UK#2, Nation's Favourites, among others. And I know we all have high hopes for Carpenters With the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra....
Last edited:
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
I totally missed this post from JuneI'm on holiday in Vegas this week and Donny and Marie have the biggest billboard advertisement on the strip. Family entertainment from sibling performers both in their 50s. In another time, another place, maybe this could have been Richard and Karen.
Did you go to their show, Stephen? I think it would be pretty good.
Marie did a duet with Olivia not too long ago called "Getting Better All The Time" and I couldn't get over how it sounded like Marie's vocals were auto tuned or something. I'm not sure but something's been done to her vocals on that track because I don't remember her sounding like that.
tomswift2002
Well-Known Member
You realize that Post was from June 2017?I totally missed this post from June
Did you go to their show, Stephen? I think it would be pretty good.
Marie did a duet with Olivia not too long ago called "Getting Better All The Time" and I couldn't get over how it sounded like Marie's vocals were auto tuned or something. I'm not sure but something's been done to her vocals on that track because I don't remember her sounding like that.
leadmister
Well-Known Member
I think they would have come back huge in the late 80's and early 90's when contemporary was popular. A bunch of new easy listening stations were popping up in LA and people like Michael Bolton, Luther Vandross, Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey and other balladeers were burning up the charts. I can picture Karen singing One Moment in Time at the Olympics instead of Whitney. I'd like to think that she would have used the lull time from '83 to about '88 getting her personal affairs squared away, such as her divorce, and then meet another man she could start to have a family with. Maybe a mother/daughter duet on one of the NBC Christmas specials.
After the whole solo album debacle, I imagine Karen would be a lot more insistent on doing more of the things she wanted to do, and would have no doubt pushed Richard to do some film and TV scoring for himself. It was the next inevitable step in their growth as both artists and individuals.
In the 2000's would come the accolades and honors. Recognition for a lifetime of contribution to the arts. Sold out summer Vegas residencies where people could enjoy the hits. I don't picture Richard being much of a creative force past the 90's, just the same as he wasn't in this particular timeline. But learning how to collaborate with others and not keeping things so close to the vest would serve Richard very well, and Karen also. I'd like to think that over time Richard would come out of his shell after having 30 or 40 years in the business, full of mostly success and accolades, with Karen there to enjoy it and take part in it with him.
After the whole solo album debacle, I imagine Karen would be a lot more insistent on doing more of the things she wanted to do, and would have no doubt pushed Richard to do some film and TV scoring for himself. It was the next inevitable step in their growth as both artists and individuals.
In the 2000's would come the accolades and honors. Recognition for a lifetime of contribution to the arts. Sold out summer Vegas residencies where people could enjoy the hits. I don't picture Richard being much of a creative force past the 90's, just the same as he wasn't in this particular timeline. But learning how to collaborate with others and not keeping things so close to the vest would serve Richard very well, and Karen also. I'd like to think that over time Richard would come out of his shell after having 30 or 40 years in the business, full of mostly success and accolades, with Karen there to enjoy it and take part in it with him.
Other than being a brother-sister act, there is no real comparison between Donny and Marie and Karen and Richard.
Donny and Marie are packing them in in Las Vegas because they, individually and as a duo, know how to put on a non-stop show. They've essentially stolen a page from Wayne Newton. When he owned the Strip, the audiences weren't there for "Red Roses for a Blue Lady" or "Daddy Don't You Walk So Fast"...they were there because he blew the roof off the place.
Donny and Marie also have the benefit of being two high-profile personalities---each making a ton of appearances on (usually daytime) TV separately.
Karen and Richard were, in my view, artistically superior to Donny and Marie---but neither was built for the hard-charging "always on" (in Marie's case, in the face of some incredible life obstacles and tragedies) that the Osmond brother and sister deliver. A lot of that may have been the baked-in psychological issues that came from their parents (essentially the polar opposites of George and Olive Osmond when it came to love and support).
PS: In a local Las Vegas TV interview last month, Donny said the show's ending with the end of the Flamingo contract next year: Osmond says Donny & Marie Las Vegas show is done in 2019
Donny and Marie are packing them in in Las Vegas because they, individually and as a duo, know how to put on a non-stop show. They've essentially stolen a page from Wayne Newton. When he owned the Strip, the audiences weren't there for "Red Roses for a Blue Lady" or "Daddy Don't You Walk So Fast"...they were there because he blew the roof off the place.
Donny and Marie also have the benefit of being two high-profile personalities---each making a ton of appearances on (usually daytime) TV separately.
Karen and Richard were, in my view, artistically superior to Donny and Marie---but neither was built for the hard-charging "always on" (in Marie's case, in the face of some incredible life obstacles and tragedies) that the Osmond brother and sister deliver. A lot of that may have been the baked-in psychological issues that came from their parents (essentially the polar opposites of George and Olive Osmond when it came to love and support).
PS: In a local Las Vegas TV interview last month, Donny said the show's ending with the end of the Flamingo contract next year: Osmond says Donny & Marie Las Vegas show is done in 2019
Last edited:
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
No I didn’t ha
Now I feel stupid.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
No harm done and to answer the question Rick, no we didn’t get to see them as I’d already booked us tickets to see Celine at the Colosseum and we were 7 rows from the front. Awesome, memorable evening. She blew us away with that show.
leadmister
Well-Known Member
Indeed it was. I liked their 72-75 shows just fine. I wish they wouldn't have changed so much of it but just continued doing what made them comfortable. If course this included Karen continuing to stay behind the kit. They fell for all the hype that was calling for them to be more showy and gimmicky and not just have it be about perfect musical performance.
Murray
Well-Known Member
What was considered "showy and gimmicky" in 1976, would be very low-key and conservative by today's standards. It seems that people nowadays don't go to a concert just to hear music, they want to see a huge spectacle... if the Carpenters had been young and touring now, they would have been expected to have lasers, strobe lights, 30-foot high video screens, dancers, acrobats, fireworks, confetti cannons... and Karen would have been singing while suspended over the audience on a trapeze!
leadmister
Well-Known Member
For sure. Their 76 show would be nothing compared to singers like Pink, Lady Gaga or Katy Perry today. I was alluding to the fact that they took too much advice and direction and, in a way, went against their gut instinct to just perform the tunes as close to the album versions as possible. Lester Bangs was one of the worst Carpenters critics at that time, and one of the biggest hypocrites. He'd go on and on about Coltrane and how people just needed to focus on the music, that that's what it should be all about, but then he'd review everything about a Carpenters show EXCEPT the music, going on about how the audience was dressed and styled, how they were dressed and styled, how they looked performing, etc. It was a big joke and poor Richard just didn't get that. He was willing to jump through hoops for a public that, for the most part, wouldn't like his stuff no matter what he did.What was considered "showy and gimmicky" in 1976, would be very low-key and conservative by today's standards. It seems that people nowadays don't go to a concert just to hear music, they want to see a huge spectacle... if the Carpenters had been young and touring now, they would have been expected to have lasers, strobe lights, 30-foot high video screens, dancers, acrobats, fireworks, confetti cannons... and Karen would have been singing while suspended over the audience on a trapeze!
Similar discussions
