⭐ Official Review Carpenters Royal Philharmonic Review and Comments Thread

[tomswift2002]

I bought the Target version of RPO, and also downloaded the RPO on Apple Music when it came out. I have since noticed some pretty substantive differences between mixes (as has been mentioned here) in the meantime.

But the biggest, to me, is an alternate take on "I Believe You." For the second part of the first verse, in my RPO version downloaded previously, Karen sings, When you TELL ME every time that we make love. In the new RPO version streaming currently on Apple Music, she sings When you SAY THAT every time that we make love.

Has anyone else noticed this? I need to check the CD from Target to see which version it is. I'm afraid to delete the older Apple version off my phone, because the new download doesn't have that alternate take -- and I enjoy both versions!

The CD tends to be labelled Version 1.0 whether it’s the regular CD or the special edition. As far as I know there has been no update to the CD.

I forget what version the LP is. The change might be on there, since the LP was released nearly a year later. I just don’t recall at the moment if it used like the Version 1.9 or something higher or if it was Version 1.0. (Of course my LP has the sound quality of a $0.25 pawn shop/charity shop LP—-that’s how it came from Universal, so it’s difficult to hear some of the different instruments.)

 

[Harry]

My recollection on "I Believe You" is:

All CDS: "...when you tell me..."
2018 downloaded files: "...when you tell me..."
2019 vinyl and downloaded files: "...when you say that..."

 

[Kyle Thomas]

My recollection on "I Believe You" is:

All CDS: "...when you tell me..."
2018 downloaded files: "...when you tell me..."
2019 vinyl and downloaded files: "...when you say that..."

That helps. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[LyndaK]

Was there a code or link provided for a digital download when the LP/CD was purchased via the official site? I had purchased the limited edition white vinyl back in 2018 and never received a free digital download. 🤔

 

[Harry]

I bought mine through Amazon and got the free mp3s.

 

[LyndaK]

I just went back to the official site and saw that digital downloads are only available in the US. That explains why I did not receive the digital download option (I am in Canada).

 

[LyndaK]

Just tried purchasing the digital download via Amazon Canada and surprisingly it is not available (only LP and CD are being sold by independent sellers).

I would be grateful if someone is willing to share the digital version of the album with me (the one I am reading about in this thread that apparently has great sound!).

 

[GDBY2LV]

I got mine on iTunes. It’s still available in the U.S. anyway. Hopefully in Canada too.

 

[newvillefan]

I’m just listening to ‘B’Wana She No Home’ and realised how great this would have been as a left-of-field inclusion on the RPO album. It’s awash with lots of little orchestral and woodwind parts that would have made it the perfect candidate. It would have also been the ideal opportunity to freshen the track up (maybe even new drum parts?) and sprinkle some modern studio technology magic over it.

 

[Murray]

I’m just listening to ‘B’Wana She No Home’ and realised how great this would have been as a left-of-field inclusion on the RPO album. It’s awash with lots of little orchestral and woodwind parts that would have made it the perfect candidate. It would have also been the ideal opportunity to freshen the track up (maybe even new drum parts?) and sprinkle some modern studio technology magic over it.

Like giving it proper stereo separation.

 

[newvillefan]

Like giving it proper stereo separation.

If Ray Gerhardt was losing his hearing by this time and responsible for the muddy sound, why didn’t anyone else (like Richard?) hear the problems inherent with much of the album and step in while it was being mixed/mastered?

 

[WYBIMLA]

If Ray Gerhardt was losing his hearing by this time and responsible for the muddy sound, why didn’t anyone else (like Richard?) hear the problems inherent with much of the album and step in while it was being mixed/mastered?

It's likely because something like "Occupants" and Argentina were taking up a lot of time. Remember they were already overbudget on this album.
So, when it gets to the last possible phase which is mastering you're already close to deadline and got to start thinking about interviews, touring or TV shows, etc.

It was already said that the single version of "Bwana" wasn't quite right obviously, so there was some type of correction made. It was already re-mixed multiple times quite likely. It was as good as it was going to get, and they were reaching a time crunch.

Industry professionals reach a point as well where that's the end of their contract. You can't keep them there to go over and over the same thing.
They have to go home at some point too, you know? Lol

There reaches a point for artists and producers where they got to compromise a bit and accept some of the losses. I'd think that you'd say "we did the best we could with what we had" and leave it at that.

I'm not saying that's always the best course of action or industry practice. It happens to the best of the best in showbiz.
Absolutely every name you can think of in the business have songs you can find that aren't the greatest.

The business model wasn't "every song has to be a hit on an album." The model was "give us one or two hits off of this thing so we can sell it."

Was B'wanna really going to keep The Carpenters up at night? I don't think it was. Maybe to us fans the muddy qualities of it are unfortunate and another song selection that's less favourable than anything they'd ever done. There comes a time where you just gotta call it "done" and get the stuff out to market.

Think about this: the song Billie Jean was mixed 91 times and eventually I think they went with mix 3. That's because the more you keep trying to mix something the producers, engineers and artist actually start to lose quality with each mix. The charming parts of it's first form degrades, and naturally it gradually becomes more of a mess.

Kind of like a painter continually painting over their canvas and basically destroying the original idea entirely. You get mud and original details are lost. It becomes something else.

So my theory (I could be wrong) is that a lot of The Carpenters work was already mixed multiple times and you're hearing that final "I think we got it. That's good enough now." Only that it probably already was great after the first few times.

There's this weird psychological phenomenon that happens in studios where an artist or producer starts becoming hyper critical and zeroing in on little aspects that aren't problematic, but the brain starts thinking it might be. Once that bit of fear sets in that it needs to be re-done somehow then you're on dozens upon dozens of mixes later and it's still not perfect. Also, you don't want to have just wasted anyone's time, so what gets onto the album?
With Carpenters it probably was a lot of the later mixing rather than "let's go back to the charm of the first time we heard it."

That's the problems with perfectionism as well. You're hearing the perfectionism. And it becomes something that's overdone. It went a little past the sweet spot a few mixes ago, but the perfectionist brain won't have it.

Thankfully with each new album or compilation project the brain will have rested and you can start again from a fresher perspective.

 

[Matthew S]

If Ray Gerhardt was losing his hearing by this time and responsible for the muddy sound, why didn’t anyone else (like Richard?) hear the problems inherent with much of the album and step in while it was being mixed/mastered?

Someday you’ll get an answer…