• Two exciting new Carpenters releases are in the pipeline! The new book Carpenters: The Musical Legacy will be available on November 16, 2021 and can be ordered here. A big thanks to the authors and Richard Carpenter for their tremendous effort in compiling this book! Also, the new solo piano album Richard Carpenter's Piano Songbook is being released January 14, 2022, and is available for ordering here.

📣 News Carpenters: "The Vinyl Collection"

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William Kucharski

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Note that I think response time depends upon what else the UMG folks are dealing with as would be the case for anyone else working in a customer service department.

I got a response to my original query in three days, and a response to my photos overnight.

As for the recall, I suspect it's not like a conventional "recall" but probably more like UMG isn't shipping any more and retailers are welcome to return what they have, but it's not like UMG said retailers MUST return what they have.
 
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Wayne Crozier

Active Member
No problem here waiting for the repressings at all, but Amazon seem so complicated with sending items back from another country. As mentioned postage costs is astronomical to return. Amazon are saying send a screenshot or picture of your return proof but don’t give the sender any idea of where to send this proof to (no links or nothing). A simple send the proof to so and so at Amazon is all that would be required but they seem to not be able to grasp it at all!. All they have done is to arrange replacements for me which i didn’t ask for knowing that they may well be as bad as the first ones.
I sometimes wish I had just been happy with my original mint pressings but this box set was so high on my agenda I jumped at it and wish I hadn’t Of now!.
 
I think some of you need to keep in mind that these retailers are not ok with a "let's make a deal" in other words credit me for 3 bad albums and I can just order them again. I'm not saying people here would do this but there are many people who want to make money or a profit off this stuff. Tell the retailer there defective get a credit and re sell them on eBay and you've made a profit.

Reading these comments make it seem that a lot of people here are making this harder than it needs to be and it appears there is no patience to wait for the re-pressings. I can't understand it myself.
Conversely, why should a buyer only be refunded for the basic price of the item and be responsible for the cost of returning a faulty item and then paying shipping costs etc to re-order the thing. You need to take note that some of us here are based in the U.K. and Amazon are requesting that the faulty items are returned within a 28 day window, otherwise they will not allow the return. Then what happens. We get a refund and then have to order again at a much higher price. At the moment here in the U.K., UMe U.K. have not aknowledged the problem and how it will be dealt with.
 

William Kucharski

Well-Known Member
To be fair to Amazon, that's long been the way mail order shopping has worked; if an item is defective it will be replaced but you are responsible for return shipping.

Most manufacturer warranties are the same way; if your amplifier dies and you didn't purchase it from the dealer, you are generally responsible for shipping costs of getting it back to the manufacturer to be repaired. Some companies also make you responsible for the cost of return shipping back to you.

Domestically, Amazon will give you a return label, but depending on the item the cost for return shipping may simply be deducted from your refund.
 

Wayne Crozier

Active Member
Whatever happens about these sets and how we get replacements of postage, sets and the like I feel it has been a good learning experience for me to get knowledge at least of the pitfalls of buying items such as this internationally, yes they are cheaper in the first instance if all’s well but if not?.
 
To be fair to Amazon, that's long been the way mail order shopping has worked; if an item is defective it will be replaced but you are responsible for return shipping.

Most manufacturer warranties are the same way; if your amplifier dies and you didn't purchase it from the dealer, you are generally responsible for shipping costs of getting it back to the manufacturer to be repaired. Some companies also make you responsible for the cost of return shipping back to you.

Domestically, Amazon will give you a return label, but depending on the item the cost for return shipping may simply be deducted from your refund.
You analogy with an amp is not quite the same especially as you cite not going through a dealer. These records have been manufactured incorrectly and the seller, Amazon, is the dealer, and they have sold faulty goods from the outset. No way should the buyer be responsible for any costs if the goods are faulty from the outset. It is against the law in the U.K. to sell a defective product and expect the buyer to pay return postage. A different thing if you simply change your mind on a product you bought and you wanted to return it.
 

Wayne Crozier

Active Member
I just wish Amazon would make the communication process more streamlined I’ve had at least 10 different customer services personnel reply to my query I’ve finally found out where to send proof of return to as they didn’t enlighten me with the information for an age

[email protected]

I do agree that sending a full set back when not all are damaged is a bit drastic?. Why not send the albums out which need replacing?. I also would imagine that Amazon won’t be able to sell these sets again when they get them back and more than likely will forward them back to Universal for a refund of trade price.
 
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Wayne Crozier

Active Member
Here is my short but sweet response from Universal U.K.

“Unfortunately we would ask you to contact Amazon USA regarding this issue“.

So I guess that means we are on our own UK buyers.
 

CARPENTERS-COLLECTOR

Well-Known Member
Here is my short but sweet response from Universal U.K.

“Unfortunately we would ask you to contact Amazon USA regarding this issue“.

So I guess that means we are on our own UK buyers.

I think that`s a disgusting response to be honest, but at the same time, understandable, because that`s where it was purchased!

I`m just listening to `loveliness` at the moment. until I bought this set, I hadn't heard a 180g vinyl before, because all I own is carpenters stuff, I do have the white `collected`, but it remains unopened at the moment. I have to say, I`m blown away by the quality of this music and think the only way to match it, would be to put my XRCD of `gold` on, but even then I couldn't separate them .......... I`m amazed!
what a great album this `lovelines` is as well. such a shame more of this stuff isn't heard on the radio, because the carpenters were more than just `close to you` and `yesterday once more`. I`m not sure about other countries, but in the U.K, all we seem to hear on the radio, is the same 3-4 songs and it`s such a shame, given how many tracks they made!!
 

Mark Pankratz

New Member
So I got a response from Universal regarding my fault vinyl set. Here it is in its entirety. Sorry if it's been shared before.

We apologize for the condition of your box set. If you would like a replacement LPs, we are asking the same thing of all customers that contact us – to please physically destroy the units and provide us with photo of the destruction for each LP that you would like replaced. This can be done by either breaking the vinyl in half/pieces or simply scratching the surface with a pair of scissors.

Upon receipt of the photos of destruction, your name will be added to our replacement list and replacement albums will be sent to the address you provide us when they are ready. I see that you have already provided your proof of purchase and address. We will require a contact phone number from you, as well.

Once we have the necessary information, we will process your reorder for the 12 LPs. Please note that you will be receiving the 12 induvial LPs.

If you do not wish to have your LPs replaced and would rather be refunded for the defective set, you will need to return your box set to the store/website you purchased it from.
 

William Kucharski

Well-Known Member
No way should the buyer be responsible for any costs if the goods are faulty from the outset. It is against the law in the U.K. to sell a defective product and expect the buyer to pay return postage.

The UK's laws are quite different; look at most any warranty in the United States and shipment from the owner to the company is on the owner's dime.

Here's the warranty for Sony TVs, for example:

https://docs.sony.com/release/Warranty_412195201.pdf

For TVs smaller than 30":

"Otherwise, to obtain warranty service, you must deliver the product, freight prepaid, in either its original packaging or packaging affording an equal degree of protection to the Sony authorized service facility specified."
 

William Kucharski

Well-Known Member
We apologize for the condition of your box set. If you would like a replacement LPs, we are asking the same thing of all customers that contact us – to please physically destroy the units and provide us with photo of the destruction for each LP that you would like replaced. This can be done by either breaking the vinyl in half/pieces or simply scratching the surface with a pair of scissors.

Upon receipt of the photos of destruction, your name will be added to our replacement list and replacement albums will be sent to the address you provide us when they are ready. I see that you have already provided your proof of purchase and address. We will require a contact phone number from you, as well.

Once we have the necessary information, we will process your reorder for the 12 LPs. Please note that you will be receiving the 12 induvial LPs.

That's new; their response used to be:

However if you would like a replacement box set, do not return the set. We are asking the same thing of all customers that contact us – to please physically destroy 3 or more LPs and provide us with photo of the destruction. This can be done by either breaking the vinyl in half/pieces or simply scratching the surface with a pair of scissors.
Perhaps UMG is realizing that some owners may attempt to sell off the remaining albums from their original set on the used market once the replacements arrive.
 
The UK's laws are quite different; look at most any warranty in the United States and shipment from the owner to the company is on the owner's dime.

Here's the warranty for Sony TVs, for example:

https://docs.sony.com/release/Warranty_412195201.pdf

For TVs smaller than 30":

"Otherwise, to obtain warranty service, you must deliver the product, freight prepaid, in either its original packaging or packaging affording an equal degree of protection to the Sony authorized service facility specified."
We are not talking about warranty issues here. A record does not come with a warranty guarantee anyway.
 

Wayne Crozier

Active Member
So I got a response from Universal regarding my fault vinyl set. Here it is in its entirety. Sorry if it's been shared before.

We apologize for the condition of your box set. If you would like a replacement LPs, we are asking the same thing of all customers that contact us – to please physically destroy the units and provide us with photo of the destruction for each LP that you would like replaced. This can be done by either breaking the vinyl in half/pieces or simply scratching the surface with a pair of scissors.

Upon receipt of the photos of destruction, your name will be added to our replacement list and replacement albums will be sent to the address you provide us when they are ready. I see that you have already provided your proof of purchase and address. We will require a contact phone number from you, as well.

Once we have the necessary information, we will process your reorder for the 12 LPs. Please note that you will be receiving the 12 induvial LPs.

If you do not wish to have your LPs replaced and would rather be refunded for the defective set, you will need to return your box set to the store/website you purchased it from.

Doesn’t seem to be Worldwide this though, I’m not in anyway capable of going through the rights and wrongs, but Universal U.K. obviously ain’t interested when they have moved the product on to secondary retailers such as Amazon!.
 

CARPENTERS-COLLECTOR

Well-Known Member
Doesn’t seem to be Worldwide this though, I’m not in anyway capable of going through the rights and wrongs, but Universal U.K. obviously ain’t interested when they have moved the product on to secondary retailers such as Amazon!.

I was just having a think about this guys and I don`t know if this is a crazy idea or not, but for those people who just have a couple of these albums faulty, wouldn't it be easier for universal to just give those people the money to buy the individual replacements for these, because the 180 gram albums you can buy individually, are exactly the same as the one`s in this set!
clearly, if people have any of these sets and they are nearly all faulty, then that's different, but why make people wait 8 weeks or so, just for one or two of these.
makes you wonder where they got the individual albums pressed, because I have 3 here are they are on a par with the Japanese stuff, their so good :)
it was just a thought I had :)
 

Wayne Crozier

Active Member
I was just having a think about this guys and I don`t know if this is a crazy idea or not, but for those people who just have a couple of these albums faulty, wouldn't it be easier for universal to just give those people the money to buy the individual replacements for these, because the 180 gram albums you can buy individually, are exactly the same as the one`s in this set!
clearly, if people have any of these sets and they are nearly all faulty, then that's different, but why make people wait 8 weeks or so, just for one or two of these.
makes you wonder where they got the individual albums pressed, because I have 3 here are they are on a par with the Japanese stuff, their so good :)
it was just a thought I had :)

At last!!, someone who has some sense!!, give the guy a heads up Amazon!. It did happen with the David Bowie boxed set “ANCIANT” that was faulty, why Amazon can’t do the same is beyond me?.
 

CARPENTERS-COLLECTOR

Well-Known Member
At last!!, someone who has some sense!!, give the guy a heads up Amazon!. It did happen with the David Bowie boxed set “ANCIANT” that was faulty, why Amazon can’t do the same is beyond me?.

I don`t about sense wayne :)
just seems crazy to make people wait as long as they are, when there`s loads of the individual albums about and given their the same, well, easily sorted surely!
what do I know ....... that's why I don`t work for universal :laugh:
I was having a look round and they made a big cock up with a set in 2015 with a dvd set, they put the wrong stuff on the discs :laugh:
 

Wayne Crozier

Active Member
I don`t about sense wayne :)
just seems crazy to make people wait as long as they are, when there`s loads of the individual albums about and given their the same, well, easily sorted surely!
what do I know ....... that's why I don`t work for universal :laugh:
I was having a look round and they made a big cock up with a set in 2015 with a dvd set, they put the wrong stuff on the discs :laugh:


I’m just on my way home and I’ve got three box sets waiting to be scrutinised (Anyone wish to open them), What awaits me is somewhat uncertain!.
 
From wh
I was just having a think about this guys and I don`t know if this is a crazy idea or not, but for those people who just have a couple of these albums faulty, wouldn't it be easier for universal to just give those people the money to buy the individual replacements for these, because the 180 gram albums you can buy individually, are exactly the same as the one`s in this set!
clearly, if people have any of these sets and they are nearly all faulty, then that's different, but why make people wait 8 weeks or so, just for one or two of these.
makes you wonder where they got the individual albums pressed, because I have 3 here are they are on a par with the Japanese stuff, their so good :)
it was just a thought I had :)
You might think this is odd, but simply giving people money may well come under money laundering rules.

As ridiculous as this may seem, I cannot quite get my head around deliberately ruining these faulty pressings. But if that’s what UMe require, then that’s what I’ll do. I destroy the faulty albums and they send me brand new copies at their expense. I can live with waiting a few more weeks - I’ve already done "needle drops" and cleaned up the sound a bit, so I can still listen to them on my digital server.
 

tcjr

Well-Known Member
Was checking the price on Amazon this morning and discovered this:
Currently unavailable
This item may be available from other sellers.
Looks like Amazon no longer has the item in stock. Maybe the repressings will be coming soon!
 

Rick-An Ordinary Fool

Well-Known Member
Was checking the price on Amazon this morning and discovered this:
Currently unavailable
This item may be available from other sellers.
Looks like Amazon no longer has the item in stock. Maybe the repressings will be coming soon!
I bet the re pressings will sound even better too. What will be interesting to see is when the re pressings are back in stock will they be priced at 150-180 or back down to 104? That's what I'm curious about seeing.
 

William Kucharski

Well-Known Member
Was checking the price on Amazon this morning and discovered this:
Currently unavailable
This item may be available from other sellers.
Looks like Amazon no longer has the item in stock. Maybe the repressings will be coming soon!

Or maybe they finally acted on my multiple notifications that UMG had recalled the set.

Re my previous "warranty" comments, my point was that unfortunately few dealers will pay for return shipping of defective merchandise, especially when it comes to vinyl.

For example, supposedly Music Direct will now pay for return shipping if you ask kindly, but in the past I spent more than the cost of the album to have to return two defective copies in a row of one album back to Chicago.
 

CARPENTERS-COLLECTOR

Well-Known Member
@tcjr - `Looks like Amazon no longer has the item in stock`

Amazon u.k are still selling it, so I wonder if it`s a stock issue rather than a withdraw.

@Lover Of Great Music

`You might think this is odd, but simply giving people money may well come under money laundering rules.`

don`t see it myself, but going along with it, their obviously not going to hand out cash, so all they have to do, is get proof of destruction of the bad albums the same way Universal are and refund the cost of replacements from the original transaction!
I just think this is more complicated and time consuming than it needs to be, yes, if customers have a lot of the albums bad, then clearly it would be easier to just swap the complete box-set, but for those who just have one or two bad, then making customers wait as long as they will is ridiculous.
like anyone here, I can only speculate, but I suspect Universal haven't re-called any of these sets, because it dos`nt make any sense to me, that retailers would continue to sell them, knowing they are going to cause themselves issues, just dos`nt make economic sense :)
 

William Kucharski

Well-Known Member
As I mentioned previously, UMG's recall likely isn't a "send us all the copies you have of this back" type of recall, but rather a "we're not shipping any further copies" recall.

To be perfectly honest, even the "good" LPs in my box set are noisier and have more defects than a vinyl reissue should.

On the other hand, UMG in particular has been bad about vinyl quality; some of their offerings are among the best sounding LPs I own, and I have one or two that literally are unplayable that I am just stuck with, as many record stores no longer accept returns on vinyl, even as defective, as music companies (that's UMG) will no longer extend them credit for defective copies; essentially for music stores they have to buy vinyl wholesale from the label but any returns they may do come out of the store's pockets, not UMG's.

This box set is a notable exception, and hopefully UMG will step up and do the same for other defective pressings; normally when I get a defective copy from my local large vinyl record store I have to just eat the cost and realize I paid $20 for a piece of vinyl that's unplayable with large visible divots in the vinyl. :sad:
 
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