I love record collecting, BUT...

[JeffM]

It's record collectors and record-store clerks who give me heartburn. There's a vinyl record shop in my town; I've nicknamed it "Old Fart Day Care." The people who work there, and the customers who hang out there, are all old ex-garage rockers who think all music created after they left school is $#!+, but everything from their days was pure gold, and boy oh boy, didn't we fuggin' rock back then, you betcha. That, muscle cars, and Tea Party politics are the main topics of conversation, and they do their damndest to put down anyone who disagrees.

Needless to say, it's a total sausage fest there. Girls don't rock! Female artists are segregated in their own section, possibly to prevent the spread of "cooties?" Blacks don't rock either; except for 50's doo-woppers, all records by black artists are in a bin labeled "R & B, Soul, Disco & Etc." (Just for fun I should also mention that at this store, the Baja Marimba Band LPS may be found in a bin marked "International/Foreign," along with Hawaiian music. Obviously, these guys' flags stopped at 48 states.)

Not long ago, the clerk and his cronies were holding forth on (of all topics!) Arthur Godfrey's "Too Fat Polka." "Yeah, I got that one for my boy. Y'know, that thing's got some great lyrics if yuh just listen to 'em. But yuh gotta listen to 'em! Yuh can't play that song now, yuh know, ohhhh, myyyy, mustn't offend anyone. These modern 'liberated' women all weigh 400 pounds, but god forbid ya should make fun of 'em!"

The conversation then somehow turned to the Blues Brothers; "Yuh know how they got started; it was a reaction against all that black disco crap." (Yeah right, a bunch of millionaire white movie stars start a pseudo-blues novelty band to show 'em how it's really done...) And last but hardly least...

"I just got back from South Carolina; I've never been so happy surrounded by real conservatives, not like this buncha dumb Swedes up here. Wife 'n' I were havin' dinner with a good ole boy down there, and he says to us, this country started slidin' down hill when they let women and (n-word plural) vote, and let all the queers outa their closet! Now that's the kinda thing we useta be able to say and laugh about, but not now, uh-UNH!!"

Well, I don't fit into any of those minorities (except 50% dumb Swede) and I was still offended. I'd been flipping LPS for an hour and hadn't found what I wanted, so it was time to leave anyway.

This record hobby sure is welcoming, ain't it?

In fairness, it's almost as bad from the other side of the fence. We have a hipster-wannabee alt-weekly here, it's pretty much a collection of columns by conspiracy-theory wackjobs. But a while back they had an I'm-too-hip-to-live music critic, whose topics usually alternated between the White Stripes and why Jim Morrison was the greatest, coolest, most genius-est musician ever.

Well, one week he devoted a whole two-tabloid-pages column to praising this terrific vocal group he had never ever heard of before...THE MILLS BROTHERS! His rationale? "I usually don't waste my time listening to granny music." I'm the Man From Uncool myself, but at least I know who those guys were. (And I agree they were great.)

And the opposite of the redneck vinyl shop here is the too-hip CD store in the next city. They have a pretty good jazz and vocalist section there, but one day I didn't see what I was looking for and asked the clerk, "Do you have any CDS by Jo Stafford?" His answer? "Who's he?" (You know, Big Jo Stafford, king of the Chicago blues...)

I'm sure what I'm writing here is bound to raise hackles from several sides, but it's all true.

 

[Mike Blakesley]

I do get a little "impatient" with people who gripe that "there's no good music being made anymore." There actually IS a lot of good music being made, you just have to find it because it's not on the radio (and there are no stores anymore). Several of my favorite bands from "back in the day" like the Doobies, the Cars, and others have released new music in the last few years and Fleetwood Mac (with Christine McVie!) is getting ready to record a new album. Boston has a new album out, ditto Starship and Asia. And, even among the newer artists there IS good stuff to be found. You can't dismiss it all just because it isn't from the good ol' days.

Is there a lot of crappy music being made today? Absolutely! But the 70s had their share of glop too. I could make a pretty long list of songs from the "good ol' days" that I would prefer never to hear again.

 

[JeffM]

I refuse to ever become a musical "dad." Most of you know what I mean..."You kids call that crap MUSIC?? Now, this is MUSIC!!"...and plays a Jim Nabors record. Is there junk music today? You bet. Was there 50 years ago? Likewise. Seems to me every generation takes it upon itself to condemn the next's music as worthless. Look at the drubbing Elvis (and rock 'n' roll in general) took in the 50's. The Beatles later took a "beating" too. And all you have to do is go back to radio comedians and Warner Bros. cartoons of the mid-1940's to see what a joke Sinatra was considered. (I won't even go into what they thought of the waltz a couple hundred years ago...) And it's fair to say that one man's trash is another's treasure as well.

There's an interesting variation of this syndrome among many critics. The music of the immediately preceding decade is disposable, but the decade before was a goldmine. (In the 60's, 40's big-band nostalgia was "in," in the 70's it was 50's "grease" oldies, and so on...)

A local FM radio station here just launched a new format a couple weeks ago, replacing a failed heavy-metal format. The new sound mixes the most melodic of today's top 40 music, with familiar oldies from the mid-60's on, and local personality DJS. It's a refreshing change from past "light" stations in the area, which seemed hopelessly stuck in the 80's. They've already received favorable press and audience reaction; I hope the sponsor support is there too.

On the other hand, I'm sad to see an AM station in the same group drop the "Music Of Your Life" format they've had for years, switching to sports talk. At last, there is now no music left on the AM dial in this market. Just three sports talkers, two right-wing talkers (only one of which admits that's their format,) and one all-Jesus-all-the-time station with commercials for fundamentalist book stores and survivalist gun stores. (There is a good AM oldies station north of here, owned by a Chippewa tribal council; but reception is dicey by day and nonexistent by night.)

 

[Rudy]

That store sounds like an anomaly. Most I go to locally (or out of state) that sell vinyl are all thriving, and cater to all sellers. Collectors are a mixed bag also. The good stores are too busy to stand around and partake in idle banter; stop in at Encore and you have a line at the counter with three employees trying to cash everyone out, while another two are scampering through the store looking up various items for whatever reason (online sales, repurchases, etc.). Sure, the store owners can be colorful individuals, but build a relationship with the ones you like and you'll get the red carpet treatment. I was such a heavy shopper at Sam's Jams in the 80s that it got to the point where they'd hold a used record or two for me before they put it out on the floor...or the guys in the jazz room would tell me about favorites of mine that were released.

I joked with one record store owner a couple of weeks ago, told him I was getting too old for record shopping. I now need glasses, maybe a magnifier, a bright LED flashlight, and it takes me a good minute to get off the ground if I'm on my knees looking through the lower bins. I'd better limber up though, as I have possible road trips this year to Columbus OH, Chicago, maybe Pittsburgh, and western Connecticut (with a possible side trip to Jersey) and will try to hit stores wherever I get a chance. A couple of us wanted to do a one month tour of record stores, and videotape our adventures for posterity...but who can ever get a month off of work anymore?

 

[Rudy]

BTW, as for the "old stuff", I partly fall into that category, only because newer recordings from some long-established artists just don't hold my attention. Maybe I should call it the Neil Diamond syndrome: love the Bang era, so-so on the Uni era, but you could dump everything Columbia and beyond into the landfill, far as I'm concerned. Yet I seek out newer music that is a bit out of the mainstream, so it's not like I'm against anything new. Some artists, I just prefer certain eras. With Rush, for example, I'm most fond of everything from Permanent Waves through Hold Your Fire. I do like the others, but this series of albums (except maybe Power Windows) are the sweet spot for me.

If it's any indication, my daughter can't stand most music that others her age like; she'd rather kick out a few old Queen albums, or Elvis, or Rush, or whatever else I listen to that she might take a liking to. She'd be happier with a decent turntable and a stack of $3.99 vinyl than having her phone filled up with nasty-sounding MP3s of today's Top 40 crap. In fact, I have a stack of about 40 duplicates I've put aside for her...

 

[JeffM]

If it's any indication, my daughter can't stand most music that others her age like; she'd rather kick out a few old Queen albums, or Elvis, or Rush, or whatever else I listen to that she might take a liking to. She'd be happier with a decent turntable and a stack of $3.99 vinyl than having her phone filled up with nasty-sounding MP3s of today's Top 40 crap. In fact, I have a stack of about 40 duplicates I've put aside for her...

Oops! You've now officially become a musical "dad"...

 

[Rudy]

Maybe my daughter is turning into "musical mom"? My ex and her older sister listen to some of that Top 40 crap--she doesn't like most of it. But also to her credit, she can't stand Journey or Bon Jovi, which are my ex's favorites.

Not surprisingly though, there are younger listeners who can't stand today's popular music either. On vinyl, try finding any of the earlier Rush albums, any Led Zep albums, and quite a few others at the used record stores, and you'll come up empty. Ditto many of the popular jazz artists. A few stores locally used to have an entire row in a bin full of Miles Davis; nowadays, all you find are two or three ratty copies of You're Under Arrest.

 

[JeffM]

For what it's worth, the guys at the local store have told me their biggest selling artist by far is KISS. Can't say I've looked there a lot for Rush, but they always have Led Zep and other 70's-80's supergroups on hand. Beatles and Elvis also plentiful. Jazz in general doesn't seem to be their strong suit; being that they have Boots Randolph, Enoch Light, and Liberace filed in their jazz section...

 

[Rudy]

I don't doubt KISS sells a lot--there's been a big resurgence in interest. Certainly not from me, though. Not my cuppa. But there are certain artists that are very popular locally. Even Steely Dan was mostly sold out. One forlorn copy of Can't Buy A Thrill, and over a dozen copies of the 2LP Greatest Hits. (I'm seeking a clean original pressing ABC cut of Aja.) What makes it worse is trying to find clean copies of what I need! Some Led Zep pressings are highly sought after, so I know those can get scarce. There's a Robert Ludwig mastering of Led Zep II that fetches huge bucks, but I couldn't even touch one in ratty condition at this point. (I just hope the upcoming 180g remasters, starting in June, sound decent.)

One thing I noticed this afternoon was that there were a few twenty-somethings that were in the store buying up a few titles. They are also into the 60s/70s artists and bands, as one of the girls in the group was asking about the Doors albums in the recent arrivals bin. It was nice to see that they were more interested in the music and, you could tell by the way they were shopping, they weren't going home to do the trendy thing and play their purchases on a Crosley record-shredder. One of the girls made me laugh, as it's something I've said myself while record crawling: "OK, I'll get it. I don't need to eat for a week!"

 

[JeffM]

Of course (this is a little off topic) used-record shops can only sell what comes in. It's not like Wal-Mart; if someone brings in your nice ABC "Aja," you'll get your wish. Aja was a pretty popular album, so with a little luck and patience, I'd guess you stand a decent chance. For some of my more...uh, eccentric "wants," I've had to resort to ebay and other online sites. Only once have I bought a record online and then saw a copy turn up locally. (With LPS in my collection like "William Frawley Sings The Old Ones," "Allen Ludden Sings His Favorites," "Phyllis Diller: Born To Sing" and "And Me? I'm Ed McMahon," I wonder why no one ever asks me to bring the music for their parties, hmmm...)

 

[Harry]

I once had a Steely Dan AJA in my collection that was probably a promo copy. It disappeared though - I fear a live-in teenaged niece might have appropriated it. In its place, I've since acquired the former WMMR on-air copy that was likely abandoned when CDs came into existence. The station purged its former on-air library one day and I grabbed a few items that intrigued me. As a hard rock station, they didn't have too much that interested me.

The AJA copy is an MCA rainbow label. The album was probably replaced a few times over the years as it got more worn, so this was likely a later-edition pressing. I just did a quick spot check and the first track on side one has some pops at the opening. The other two tracks on that side sounded pretty clean.

Harry

 

[JeffM]

This one's for you, Rudy. And yes, that's Eartha Kitt reading the sales pitch.

 

[Rudy]

Of course (this is a little off topic) used-record shops can only sell what comes in. It's not like Wal-Mart; if someone brings in your nice ABC "Aja," you'll get your wish. Aja was a pretty popular album, so with a little luck and patience, I'd guess you stand a decent chance. For some of my more...uh, eccentric "wants," I've had to resort to ebay and other online sites. Only once have I bought a record online and then saw a copy turn up locally. (With LPS in my collection like "William Frawley Sings The Old Ones," "Allen Ludden Sings His Favorites," "Phyllis Diller: Born To Sing" and "And Me? I'm Ed McMahon," I wonder why no one ever asks me to bring the music for their parties, hmmm...)

High volume shops do see those obscure titles, but might only see them once every several years. When Car City Classics was still around, the owner had seen the 1953 album Moondog and His Friends but only a couple of times since he opened the store. Encore Records has a window display each month, and during election month (November), they often put out "political" obscurities for display. Quite amusing some of the titles!

Around here, the more common and sought after titles turn around as soon as they hit the door. Even the Queen selection was non-existent--I'm seeking a better first pressing of The Game, and the store only had 15 or so copies of Jazz...and nothing else! Some shops have "new arrival" bins, which helps regulars like me, since I can bypass the main bins if I'm just making a quick "what's new" stop. The popular titles probably leave the new arrival bins soon after arriving. Other stores (in general) list the more desirable titles on eBay, Discogs, GEMM, Musicstack, etc. since they can get more money for them. Can't say I blame the stores--they need to make money at this.

 

[Rudy]

The AJA copy is an MCA rainbow label. The album was probably replaced a few times over the years as it got more worn, so this was likely a later-edition pressing. I just did a quick spot check and the first track on side one has some pops at the opening. The other two tracks on that side sounded pretty clean.

The MCA versions are hit or miss. If it's the black rainbow label, it probably will be cleaner than the later "cloud" label, where I know they pressed many of those with recycled vinyl and some could be very noisy. (And some of the Steely Dan titles I bought new back then, in the "Platinum Series" or whatever it was, were not only noisy, but often sounded dull and lifeless.)

I have a Royal Scam in decent shape but there is almost no bass on that mastering! Not sure if it's just that version or not, but the CD versions I've had were a bit fuller.

 

[JeffM]

How'd this end up turning into a panel on Steely Dan instead of one on clerks 'n' jerks in record shops? Anywho, the little vinyl shop of horrors I mentioned at the beginning has a cast of characters that amount to all the stereotypes of record-store clerks. In addition to Mr. Tea Party, the other rotating regulars include a metalhead stoner type who tests the stylus on their very expensive in-store turntable by thwumping his thumb back and forth across it, and who tries to talk you into buying crackle-fried copies you don't want ("Duuude, that don't sound so bad; whadya want for that price?") and a self-styled former big city DJ (probably boozed himself out of the job) whose voice runs from loud to louder and is constantly pumping you with pointless questions while you're browsing, which gets real old real fast.

I've actually been heckled for putting certain records on the store turntable for listening ("I HATE THAT RECORD!! You mean you want that piece of $#!+??") Yes, I did, and I bought it anyway. The owners, who have their day jobs, run the place on weekends; one is an ex-garage rocker who has self-compiled a DVD containing four hours of nothing but concert drum solos, the other will gladly expound on his sexual fantasies about Reba McIntyre. It's a small town and the only record store within at least 150 miles, so you go to them or you go without. (All I can add is that all of this is true.)

 

[Dave]

Ahhhhh....Steely Dan and crappy record stores--C'mon, you gotta love the idea of SOME CONNECTION!!!!

Now, pardon the "Evil" Smiley that I used, and to get back to topic, of which all points here thoroughly speculated I can only briefly summarize... And that is:

Categories: Yeh, RACE unless it's "White Man's Guitar Work"--and I'm speaking of Jimi Hendrix here,--or the many of Rock's fore-runners of the '50's when the genre was actually being invented, whether Bo Diddley, Fats Domino, Chuck Berry or any of the "Bird Groups", Do-Wop, etc.--and I don't wanna put anything in here that's gonna throw anything here that will be taken in any wrong, derogatory way,--defines ROCK, otherwise it goes in (a) Disco, or (b) R&B...! (And we can figure what will go in (c) Rap...!)

Anyone wearing a Stetson, is COUNTRY, while stuff like International, Religious, and of course, Blues and Jazz, speaks for itself...

So, if I were to open a record store I would probably one of the few that would "Un-Catagorize" anything, except to File/Sell Alphabetically, and might I say, I've shopped at a store, or two in my life-time selling their wares this way...!

If I'm gonna listen to crap that a store plays over its speakers, then I have a right to test play what I want to listen to, and how are you gonna hear it if I'm wearing headphones? And sorry if I don't want to buy it afterwards, either...

Usually most store owners & clerks are friendly & to the point that I just out of returning their niceness will buy at least SOMETHING, then, out of good gesture...

Lastly, I wonder how anything going there for a Quarter or a Dollar tends to fetch bigger bucks Online, whether it's an auction at eBay, or MusicStack, or GEMM?! Amd fathom even more that I could bring something in of that breed, for trading or selling, and some how a store I do such loyal business at isn't interested... (Maybe I need to get into that sort of a racket...!)


-- Dave

 

[Rudy]

You definitely need a better store in town.

I used to avoid one shop because the owner was a heavy smoker, which triggered my asthma. Yet he was a great guy to talk with since we had a lot of common musical interests. He was a huge Call Tjader fan and a fan of Latin music in general. Sad to hear that he passed away, but his daughter now runs the shop. And she's in a larger location now.

 

[JeffM]

So, if I were to open a record store I would probably one of the few that would "Un-Catagorize" anything, except to File/Sell Alphabetically, and might I say, I've shopped at a store, or two in my life-time selling their wares this way...!

If I'm gonna listen to crap that a store plays over its speakers, then I have a right to test play what I want to listen to, and how are you gonna hear it if I'm wearing headphones? And sorry if I don't want to buy it afterwards, either...

Thanks for your comments. I should have been more clear that the store has only the one turntable and no headphones available. The clerks and owners generally have "their" records playing all day, and you have to wait your turn until their (usually LP) is over to spin your disc. When they're not around to change the record; say, at the checkout or in the can; I remove their disc and set it aside with its sleeve as carefully as if it were my own.

When I'm a little cheezed off with them though, I have been known to slide the speed control (it's one of those turntables with variable speed and a neon stroboscope) until "their" record sounds like it was side-swiped by David Seville!

I like the "uncategorized" idea too; though some products may physically call for separation (operas in box sets, kiddie records in odd sizes, speeds, or shapes). Why not Sinatra, Paul Simon, and Snoop Dogg in the same bin under "S" indeed? (Yes indeed!)

Should mention that the too-hip CD store I mentioned has a divider card that always cracks me up: "C, S, N, and Sometimes Y"!

 

[Dave]

You definitely need a better store in town.

Better, is right!

My haunt in Hamtramck, Vinyl Graveyard, formerly Desirable Discs (which was once based in Dearborn & had a store in Garden City) keeps moving & now is in some neighborhood, & so far the only advantage of looking for it, has been Free Parking...! Though having not been to it for months, maybe might finally have new, good stuff, like it did, that once upon a time!

What a shame we'd lost Car City--one more thing to have made 2011 a mighty sad year, and just when I'd had latched onto a few more collecting interests... Record Collector in Ferndale left us in 2012, right down to the owner putting out the last of his inventory, fixtures & shelving out in front of the place, for free, after he'd finally boarded up! And some new place operates in that same area across the street, though so far little has drawn me in after that one, first time I had gone in...

That leaves East & West--Melodies & Memories of Eastpoint & my journeys out to Ann Arbor (try to limit my self to Free Parking Sundays) to find what's still regularly rarities in rotation & still reasonably priced (and who both had sizable Pat Boone vinyl I could buy an "all of", particularly what's Mint and/or rare!)...!

Some other place I forget the name of once in Roseville has been long gone, and they'd tried an unsuccessful venture in a downtown Ferndale location in front of Record Collector... While years back was some other record store going from a corner location in a shopping strip, to a single, solitary building just to fold, supplanted by another record/memorabilia dealer Blast From The Past...!



-- Dave

 

[Dave]

I used to avoid one shop because the owner was a heavy smoker, which triggered my asthma. Yet he was a great guy to talk with since we had a lot of common musical interests. He was a huge Call Tjader fan and a fan of Latin music in general. Sad to hear that he passed away, but his daughter now runs the shop. And she's in a larger location now.

Are you talking about SOLO on Woodward Ave? Well, yes, his daughter runs the store along w/ a few hired hands, & I haven't seen the owner for a while, but I would have not have had any idea that he died...

His daughter is a Facebook friend of mine, and I haven't seen or heard of any news there & maybe I can go over to the record store & if she's there get a little more fact...!

'Solo' and I do go back a long ways, though! Probably the 2nd-most place after Sam's Jams in Ferndale that splintered into Record Collector and Desirable Discs that I'd had my mom take me to until I could drive there myself...

Nice that after Thirty-Plus-Years how a record store can STILL remain in business (when it's runright, of course!)


-- Dave

 

[JeffM]

I've accidentally run into the perfect T-shirt for record collectors. The seller actually made these with "bounce house" enthusiasts in mind (!) but judge for yourself...

http://www.zazzle.com/i_love_the_smell_of_vinyl_in_the_morning_t_shirts-235851078288543935

 

[Rudy]

Actually that shirt also has BDSM overtones...

Someone made a point several years ago on another forum. About record shows. Something about the unbathed masses in wife-beaters who hadn't seen the business end of a stick of deodorant in 20 years. Wish I had a t-shirt for that one.

 

[JeffM]

Context is everything...

 

[Rudy]

True dat.

 

[Dave]

Anyone wearing a Stetson, is COUNTRY, while stuff like International, Religious, and of course, Blues and Jazz, speaks for itself...




-- Dave

Oh, and Pop Vocalists, Easy Listening, Classical & Instrumental Pop...!

To, me, Vinyl smells good right now, when the kid's gone to sleep, in wee hours of night!!!!


-- Dave