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Jobim on EQUINOX

Discussion in 'Look Around: Sergio Mendes/Brazilian Music Forum' started by Harry, Jan 24, 2016.

  1. Harry

    Harry Charter Member Moderator Thread Starter

    Though Steve S. posted this interview back in May of last year, I never got a chance to view it all the way through. I happened upon it today:

    and was fascinated that between the times of 28 and 32 minutes, Lani relates a story of Tom Jobim singing "Wave" to her in her hotel room while asking her opinion of the English lyrics. She goes on to mention that Jobim actually performed on the EQUINOX album. Though he's not in the credits as performing, can we assume that he played on the three tracks that he composed?

    Is the guitar that we've attributed to John Pisano on those tracks actually Antonio Carlos Jobim?

  2. Rudy

    Rudy ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Site Admin

    Probably better to ask, than guess at it... :wink: Lani, Pisano and Mendes are all still with us, as is engineer Bruce Botnick.

    Jobim and Mendes worked together on an LP earlier in the 60s, so it's no stretch that he'd appear on a Brasil '66 album. Jobim appears uncredited most likely for contractual reasons. 1967...I think he was primarily with Verve in the US at that point, or possibly Warner/Reprise. He's had albums on both labels.

    As for Pisano vs. Jobim on guitar, I do hear both. Jobim was known more for his piano than guitar on his own albums, but he was prominently featured on guitar on his Wave LP. His guitar is also nicely featured on Sinatra/Jobim. Apply that style you hear on those albums to Equinox and it fits. Pisano is also a flexible and versatile guitarist, yet was primarily playing electric guitar in those days, along with the occasional stringed instruments as needed elsewhere (mandolin, etc.).

    I put no weight on him playing on his own compositions. The guitar in "Cinnamon and Clove" is textbook Jobim. Jobim was not a lead guitar player like Pisano--he more or less strummed along in that syncopated style made popular by Joao Gilberto back in the day, using a classical guitar. And that is pretty much all Jobim did on the guitar, at least on the albums I've heard him on--very simple and economic style, and it worked.

    Upon listening, Pisano is at least on "Watch What Happens," "Arrastão," "Bim-Bom," and "Wave."

    Jobim on "Cinnamon and Cloves," "Gente," "Triste," "Wave," and "Só Danço Samba."

    Yes, for now, I believe I hear both on "Wave." (I am not in a position to listen loud enough to pick them apart at the moment.) Pisano is doing his lead guitar part, yet I also hear some classical guitar deep in the mix (more the "thump"...don't know how I can explain it, but I hear it).

    I call it classical guitar as I'm pretty sure he used a nylon-strung guitar (which can have that slightly "thumpy" characteristic depending on how it is recorded). It certainly sounds like it. Acoustic guitar these days refers to an unamplified, hollow-bodied guitar with steel strings, whereas classical normally uses nylon. We have one of each in the house--they are similar, but have unique sounds. My Goya classical guitar sounds a lot more like Jobim's guitar than the dreadnought style my daughter has, which has more of an edgy attack to it.
    Acapulco 1922 and Bobberman like this.
  3. Harry

    Harry Charter Member Moderator Thread Starter

    Compare the openings of "Triste" on both EQUINOX and WAVE. Quite similar!
    Bobberman likes this.
  4. Bobberman

    Bobberman Well-Known Member

    Yes Indeed. I dont think there is any reason to believe that both Jobim and Pisano arent on the same songs because to my ears the playing styles are Very similar.( the influence can be contagious.) Nevertheless It's all Excellent.
  5. Rudy

    Rudy ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Site Admin

    Indeed. That guitar sound is not easily mistaken. Also, check out Sinatra/Jobim. More relaxed but the same basic tone.

    Bobberman likes this.
  6. Hardbossa

    Hardbossa New Member

    Perhaps many people don't know, but Tom Jobim also appeared as a special guest artist playing guitar with the nickname "Tony Brazil" on the jazz pianist Jack Wilson album titled "Brazilian Mancini" on the obscure label Vault 1001
    junglero and Rudy like this.
  7. Steve Sidoruk

    Steve Sidoruk Founder, A&M Fan Net Moderator

    If Jobim played on EQUINOX, it must have been 'off the books,' because he wasn't listed on the AFM session sheets for this album.
    Bobberman likes this.
  8. lj

    lj Active Member

    Things were different in the 1960s. For example, big movie stars would never dream of doing television series. They were "above" doing that sort of thing. Unlike today, liner notes on pop albums in the 1960s more often than not did not mention studio or guest musicians. For example, the famous Wrecking Crew were never credited on albums for all they work they did in the 1960s. And for someone as famous as Jobim, he may have preferred that people not know that he was only playing a "supporting role" on the Equinox album. Times have changed, nowadays musicians are proud to proclaim they were a guest artist on somebody's album.
    Bobberman likes this.
  9. Bobberman

    Bobberman Well-Known Member

    Very true these days Drummer Hal Blaine for example has repeatedly proclaimed His participation on Herb's Lonely Bull sessions and also The late Ventures drummer Mel Taylor has made the same claims in his later years. ( according to what i have heard and read over the years.)
  10. Mike Blakesley

    Mike Blakesley Well-Known Member Moderator

    "Triste" is one of my favorite Brasil '66 "album tracks." That song just exudes coolness.

    I suppose it's also possible that he just didn't ask for credit, preferring to leave the spotlight on Sergio's band.

    I think another reason for the lack of musician credits in the '60s and before was, there was no union requirement to list the supporting players, and the "focus" was supposed to be on the star performer, so, the labels reasoned, why draw attention to the supporting musicians? Plus a lot of bands in those days "supposedly" played their own instruments, so nobody wanted to reveal that there were other players involved, lest they sully the good name of The Monkees or whoever.
    Bobberman likes this.
  11. I wonder if Sergio Mendes played piano on the 1967 released album Reprise ‘Antonio Carlos Jobim & Francis Albert Sinatra? Maybe Yes or ~Maybe no?
  12. lj

    lj Active Member

    In Wikipedia under the heading of Sinatra-Jobim Sessions, for the personnel it says that Jobim played the piano, as well as the guitar.
  13. "Chove Chuva" is, likely, the only Latin jazz song ever to feature a SITAR(!).
  14. Rudy

    Rudy ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Site Admin

    Thinking about this again...he would have been "off the books" if there were contractual issues. If he were making an appearance for his pal Sergio and not wanting any compensation (or, any conflicts regarding his recording contracts elsewhere), then it makes sense he would not appear in the credits or in any of the contracts for Sergio's album.
  15. lj

    lj Active Member

    Rudy, your comments are well taken. In 1967 Jobim released on Warner Brothers Records "A Certain Mr. Jobim", and yet in 1967 he also recorded and released on A&M/CTI the "Wave" album. Based on past AOTW forum posts it shows that some tracks for Equinox were recorded on 1-14-67 and 2-19-67 and Wave was recorded on May 22,23,24, and June 15, 1967, so Jobim was in the USA in the first half of 1967 to be active on both Equinox and Wave. Back in the 1960s and 1970s recording artists often appeared on other non-contractual record labels with the album liner notes saying something like appears courtesy of --and then the name of artists contractual record company. For whatever reason Jobim and A&M/CTI and Warner Brothers opted not to do this on the Equinox album.
  16. Rudy

    Rudy ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Site Admin

    I always wondered about the CTi contract--he recorded Stone Flower for CTi but that was distributed by Columbia, post A&M. It makes me wonder if the actual contract was with CTi for all three albums, as opposed to A&M.
  17. Warner Bros. would've controlled Reprise by 1962 (when Sinatra sold it to Mo Ostin) -- so, there would not have been a conflict between a Jobim/WB7 solo album and, the Sinatra-Jobim Reprise album; at least, in THAT regard.
  18. lj

    lj Active Member

    Per the link below, Creed Taylor said that originally CTI was a subsidiary of A&M, and A&M would distribute the CTI records produced by Taylor such as Jobim's Wave. Later at Taylor's request, he and Alpert had an friendly breakup and CTI was on its own.

    Interview: Creed Taylor (Part 15) »
    Bobberman likes this.
  19. Rudy

    Rudy ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Site Admin

    It sounds, then, like the artists were signed with Taylor vs. being signed to A&M. That does make sense with Jobim's third album being on the CBS-distributed CTi vs. the earlier two during the A&M days.

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