Music Volume 3 - Herb Alpert Reimagines the Tijuana Brass

Discussion in 'The Beat of The Brass: Herb Alpert/Tijuana Brass' started by Captaindave, Jul 18, 2018.

  1. martin

    martin Active Member

    I have also found that the album grows on me. I found it, as I said, very entertaining from the very first listening, but later I have discovered that there is more to it than that. It is both fun, and at times moving (America and Spanish Harlem) and as Rudy said, it does not take away the originals, they can not really be competed with. I made a playlist with the reimagined tracks combined with the originals and that was very rewarding, both in the appreciation of the originals and in the appreciation of the reimagination. I tend to think of it as Herb going out with a new TJB and playing the songs for a 2018 audience. It would have to sound something like that.

    - greetings from the north -
  2. martin

    martin Active Member

    I am in the L.A. area this days and was able to get the CD from Amoeba music in Hollywood today. It's a very nice package but I noticed that Pat Senatore was not mentioned on the "Thank you"- list with all the musicians playing on the TJB records. It is obviously just a mistake, but a little bit sad for him, I think. I have often seen him at the Vibrato Club on my previous visits here, and he has always seemed quite happy to chat about the TJB days

    - greetings from L.A. -
    Bobberman likes this.
  3. Captaindave

    Captaindave Well-Known Member Thread Starter

    I have wondered exactly what the "A Special Thank You To These Great Musicians" actually means. Many of those names mentioned are associated with the session players known as the "Wrecking Crew".

    Did Pat Senatore actually play on the TJB songs that are represented on the Music Volume 3 album? It seems to me that many of these songs are from that period of time when the music was provided by Wrecking Crew members that were doing sessions in the 1960s. Nick Ceroli, Bob Edmondson, and John Pisano are the names that are listed that were members of the TJB as pictured on albums from Going Places onward. However, I have never associated them with the Wrecking Crew; but they may have done some playing.

    My memory tells me that Julius Wechter provided the marimba sounds for all TJB recordings.

    I know this discussion has come up before as to who played when, and on what specific songs and albums. There is also no mention of Tonni Kalash nor Lou Pagani in that list of credits. Herb Alpert is usually credited with providing all the trumpet parts on all the original recordings.

    I don't pretend to know the answer, but I do think that it has been established at some point in previous discussions that the touring TJB as pictured on albums from Going Places forward did play in the studio, with maybe with some additional musicians here and there. I think that Julius Wechter provided the marimba any time you hear that instrument anywhere.

    The recordings prior to Going Places mostly used the Wrecking Crew.
    toeknee4bz likes this.
  4. Mike Blakesley

    Mike Blakesley Well-Known Member Moderator

    This is correct. The musicians who got credit on the new album are the ones who appeared on the original albums from Going Places forward -- some of that music is sampled in the new album. Herb used Wrecking Crew musicians throughout the TJB's career whenever he felt like one of them could give him the exact sound he wanted. As he put it in an interview, some players are better at certain types of rhythms than others.

    There has been speculation as to Tonni Kalash's role in the studio. He is listed as a player on the session records, but Herb has verified that he himself played all the trumpet parts (except in orchestras, like on "Carmen.") We've guessed that Tonni did play in the studio, to give Herb someone to play off of; but then Herb recorded the second parts himself.
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2018
  5. martin

    martin Active Member

    Yes, that is a possible explanation of course, but I believe Pat was part of the very first Tjb line up at the Crescendo date, and he obviously played on sone of the later TJB albums.

    Greetings from L.A
    Bobberman likes this.
  6. Harry

    Harry Charter A&M Corner Member Moderator

    As Pat was a bass player, and much of the original bass lines have been replaced/enhanced, perhaps all of his playing has been removed. ? Just a thought.
  7. Bobberman

    Bobberman Well-Known Member

    I noticed the absence of the original Bass lines but then again my ears aren't what they used to be
  8. Rudy

    Rudy ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Site Admin

    In addition, I believe he has said the TJB was more of a "sound" or "idea" than a "band," so I feel he would tend to use the different musicians like an artist choosing which colors and shades to use in a painting.
    I was "one and done" with this one, so I didn't even notice. :wink:
    Bobberman likes this.
  9. Steven J. Gross

    Steven J. Gross Well-Known Member

    Ultimately the downfall of this album is "America", I was looking forward to a beat and it would have been better off not included. It is one of my favorite TjB songs, this version is a bummer, an album killer...
    Bobberman likes this.
  10. Steve Sidoruk

    Steve Sidoruk Founder, A&M Fan Net Moderator

    Kind of over the top negativity - if you don't like one track, it certainly doesn't take down the entire album. I like it a lot, but if you don't warm to it, go back and groove on all the originals and at least appreciate that Herb & Randy released all the recent re-masters!
  11. DeeInKY

    DeeInKY Well-Known Member

    I’m enjoying it. I put things into and out of rotation in my car (for all those visits to the alternate location) and currently my grouping is Music Vol. 1, Music Vol. 3, a Muscle Shoals retrospective, and the Beatles “1”.
    Bobberman likes this.
  12. Bobberman

    Bobberman Well-Known Member

    I totally Agree Steve
    Captaindave likes this.
  13. I agree to much negativity. I love it the only thing for me is the bass is to thumpy a little more mellow would be better other than that Awsome.
    Bobberman likes this.
  14. Bobberman

    Bobberman Well-Known Member

    Although America may be a letdown to some as it was done radically different than before it doesn't necessarily bring down the Album and it being the closing track it doesn't distract me from the other songs which are quite upbeat and I still think it's worth having and I will say after over a decade of using the "Rewhipped" Lollipops and roses" as the closing theme to my radio show I decided to replace it with the "Reimagined" Green Peppers" which still fits the upbeat and positive spirit of my shows
    DeeInKY likes this.
  15. Rudy

    Rudy ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Site Admin

    I'm still saying that "America" was Herb's "message" tune on this recording, which some feel is fitting for the times. At least it wasn't like Bacharach alienating many of his listeners with "Who Are These People?" from his At This Time album (the "real" version, with the uncensored ending, being the original version Burt wrote). Don't like it? Skip it. Not a big deal, I'm thinking. :shrug: Nobody took the old version away from us.
    martin, Bobberman and DeeInKY like this.
  16. Bobberman

    Bobberman Well-Known Member


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