Supertramp Box Set???

[Benjamin Edge]

Has anyone ever thought of when Supertramp will ever release a box set of its material through A&M (from 1970-88)?

The group's studio albums:
* Supertramp (1970; U.S. release 1977)
* Indelibly Stamped (1971)
* Crime of the Century (1974)
* Crisis? What Crisis? (1975)
* Even in the Quietest Moments (1977)
* Breakfast in America (1979)
* ... Famous Last Words ... (1982)
* Brother Where You Bound? (1985)
* Free as a Bird (1987)

Live albums:
* Paris (1980)
* Live '88 (1988)

Compilations:
Classics, Vol. 9 (1987)
The Very Best of Supertramp (1992; U.S. release 2001) (similar to Classics Vol. 9 except for the addition of "School," which leads the CD)
The Very Best of Supertramp, Vol. 2 (1993)
Retrospectacle: The Supertramp Anthology (2005; also known as Supertramp: Gold)

Lost material wanted:
"Land Ho" (early version with seagull intro)
"Land Ho" (original 1974 single release)
"School" (demo version)
"Bloody Well Right" (demo version)
"Dreamer" (1968 Roger Hodgson demo version)
"Rudy" (with Wurlitzer piano track and flute track)
"You Started Laughing (When I Held You in My Arms)" (1975) (original version; was B-side to "Lady" single)
"The Logical Song" (demo version)
"The Logical Song" (extended version, longer than the 4:08 album version)
"Goodbye Stranger" (demo version)
"Goodbye Stranger" (extended version, longer than the 5:47 album version)
"Take the Long Way Home" (extended version, longer than the 5:02 album version)
"Breakfast in America" (1968 Roger Hodgson demo version with his harmonium called "Grandma")
"It's Raining Again" (1968 Roger Hodgson demo version)

The recording of "Land Ho" which is track 3 on Retrospectacle is a 1975 remake which was intended to be released on the Crisis? What Crisis? LP. Roger Hodgson re-recorded the song himself for release on his 1987 solo album, Hai Hai.

The second disc of the Breakfast in America (Deluxe Edition) CD set is all live recordings. Most of those performances were done at the same show that made up the 16 tracks for the Paris live double-album, including "Goodbye Stranger," "Even in the Quietest Moments" and "Child of Vision."

In effect, there could easily have been a Paris Deluxe Edition version spanning three discs, which is an amalgam of the 16 songs off the original 2-LP/2-CD set and the songs off the second CD from the BIA Deluxe album, but using the proper order per the set list. The venue in question was the Pavillon de Paris, on November 29-30, 1979.

~Ben

 

[Benjamin Edge]

Since my 15-minute edit time expired, I'm going to add this:

Any songs I've listed which say "1968 Roger Hodgson demo" are those songs Roger had composed before he even joined Supertramp.

~Ben

 

[Rudy]

It would be neat to reconstruct that Paris concert in original set list order.

We actually have a section in the works for Supertramp and their contemporaries...I'll move your thread to that new section when it opens, as we'll need a catalyst to get it moving.

 

[jfiedler17]

It is rather stunning that Supertramp has never got a box set to this day, even in spite of being one of the most omnipresent acts on classic-rock radio, but then I don't believe their A&M labelmates Styx or Peter Frampton have, either, and they're just as much of a staple on classic-rock stations. (I really can't think of a lot of A&M artists in general, actually, who've been given the box-set treatment. Cat Stevens and the Police have, ditto the Carpenters, but I can't remember any others off the top of my head. I'm sure someone else here can answer that one for me! We were actually talking in another thread just recently about how unfortunate it is that Joe Jackson - another of A&M's essential acts - has never had a box release of any type, given the overwhelming amount of non-LP B-sides, stray cuts, soundtrack contributions, and miscellaneous oddities in his catalog that have never been collected onto either LP or CD. He's a tricky one to collect.)

Gosh, would a Supertramp box be wonderful to have!, even if just a 3-or-4-CD-box that incorporated a lot of the rarer material. (Another rarity that would be cool to see them include on the box: the one-off pre-Supertramp single Hodgson released for DJM Records under the name Argosy, with Elton John and Nigel Olsson backing him. Always been curious to hear that one.) Particularly considering that even when they were still with A&M, not everything they issued got an American release; the first album, as you pointed out, didn't get released here 'til '77; "Land Ho" b/w "Summer Romance" didn't get released here; Live '88 didn't get released here; even their greatest-hits package The Autobiography of Supertramp didn't come out in the U.S. until the year after its release everywhere else around the world, and even then, it was just packaged as a volume in part of A&M's Classics series. (And as you pointed out, even The Very Best of Supertramp didn't see a U.S. release until nine years later.) [There was a greatest-hits package of sorts released as a promo item back in '83 called Supersampler that was pressed on translucent purple vinyl and contains five back-catalog hits (i.e. "The Logical Song," "Bloody Well Right") alongside three album cuts from Famous Last Words ..., but it's no easy find. I've only ever seen pictures of it.]
And some of the original '70-'88 albums are horribly tricky to find on CD these days. (And I don't think I've ever run across a copy of either of Hodgson's solo albums for A&M on CD, which is a shame, too, 'cause I really like those. I've just got vinyl copies of those, and I've had Hai Hai since I was nine, so needless to say, it's a little worn these days. I didn't take the greatest of care of my records back then. )

 

[Benjamin Edge]

I was thinking about a complete recordings set which includes all of their album cuts with demos and stray singles mixed in... like The Police one you mention (Message in a Box).

~Ben

 

[Rudy]

One thing bothering me is that the days of big, lavish box sets is near an end with the major labels. They would rather lavish their attention on a few of their biggest cash cows, and the rest are lucky to see anthology CDs released every few years to churn some money out of the vaults.

Universal in particular--they'll repackage and remaster The Who and Elton John a couple of times per decade, yet many other deserving bands and artists barely get anything more than an anthology. Granted, the trend overseas is to reissue CDs with the latest marketing lingo (such as SHM CDs), but those are not really a proper remastering.

One trend in box sets, though, are the budget box sets. Some feature maybe five classic albums by an artist. Others go for the "Complete" approach. And they are usually budget priced. The mini-LP sleeves are sort of an authentic touch, but they are also dirt cheap to print, in comparison to doing a glossy booklet for a CD in a jewel case or DigiPak. In these sets, you usually find 1) these are albums only, no rarities, and 2) they are often from existing masterings if they have been on CD previously. Trust me, a label will not go to the expense to remaster 19 Dave Brubeck albums for a "Complete" box set that sells for under $100; they'd never sell enough to come anywhere near breaking even. For several years I had tried to find all of the Bill Withers albums on CD...I'd finally gotten all but one (as 'Bout Love never was issued on CD--most of the others were imports). And about a year later, his "Complete Recordings" box set came out, and it was so ridiculously cheap that I think I paid as much for the set as I did for one of those import CDs...and it even came with a nice booklet! Just one of many examples I can think of.

With the A&M artists, I really can't explain how groups as popular as Supertramp, Styx and Frampton don't get some competent remasterings and have their back catalogs reissued and possibly assembled as box sets. Similar artists with the same or even less popularity get a lot more attention!

Given the fire at Universal, too, we can't even know what might have survived. The tapes (original multitrack, two-channel mixes, LP masters, etc.) are stored in a few different places, but there's no way of knowing what survived, and where.

 

[Dave]

These guys deserve one...!


-- Dave

 

[jfiedler17]

One thing bothering me is that the days of big, lavish box sets is near an end with the major labels. They would rather lavish their attention on a few of their biggest cash cows, and the rest are lucky to see anthology CDs released every few years to churn some money out of the vaults

Universal in particular--they'll repackage and remaster The Who and Elton John a couple of times per decade, yet many other deserving bands and artists barely get anything more than an anthology. Granted, the trend overseas is to reissue CDs with the latest marketing lingo (such as SHM CDs), but those are not really a proper remastering ...

With the A&M artists, I really can't explain how groups as popular as Supertramp, Styx and Frampton don't get some competent remasterings and have their back catalogs reissued and possibly assembled as box sets. Similar artists with the same or even less popularity get a lot more attention!

Those aforementioned A&M acts at least have had 2-CD best-ofs, but even those they don't always manage to get right. All of Styx's Top 40 hits could fit on a single disc, and yet their only double-disc anthology covering the A&M years (Come Sail Away, from '04, later repackaged as Gold) not only doesn't include them all ("Why Me," "Music Time," and "Love at First Sight" are all missing) but the compilers inexplicably managed to omit one of their Top Ten hits ("Don't Let It End"). [Styx would be a good candidate for a box, too, considering that they've actually got quite a few studio outtakes in the vaults that have never seen any kind of release, including an entire follow-up album to Edge of the Century that A&M opted to shelve, much to the devastation of DeYoung and Burtnik, and has never surfaced.]
The Supertramp one (Retrospectacle) is really well-done for the most part. It'd be nice had they used the studio version of "You Started Laughing" instead of the live version from Paris, and I wouldn't have minded seeing the first album represented by something other than just the brief minute-long version of "Surely" ("Nothing to Show" is actually my favorite cut from that album and would have been my own personal pick), but those are minor quibbles, and they did a really good job of not overlooking any hits and picking most of the best album tracks to round out the package. Definitely the best of all their compilations, I think.

Considering the number of non-LP cuts in their catalog (just under a hundred, actually), it's sorta amazing we've never seen a Squeeze boxed set, either; they're one of those rare A&M acts, like The Police, whose B-sides were consistently utilized to issue stray cuts rather than just additional "filler" cuts from the parent albums, so they're not the easiest of bands to collect.

 

[Captain Bacardi]

It would be neat to reconstruct that Paris concert in original set list order.

I don't know, I thought Paris was a horrible release. The performances were all lackluster. I had high hopes when I bought that LP and was thoroughly bummed after listening to it. I stopped listening to Supertramp after that debacle. Their studio albums were great but they couldn't reproduce that sound in concert.



Capt. Bacardi

 

[Benjamin Edge]

I don't know, I thought Paris was a horrible release. The performances were all lackluster. I had high hopes when I bought that LP and was thoroughly bummed after listening to it. I stopped listening to Supertramp after that debacle. Their studio albums were great but they couldn't reproduce that sound in concert.



Capt. Bacardi

I think what you said is due to the apparent limitations of synthesizers at that time (1979)... since then, synthesizers were then improved to sound more realistic. I know that synthesizers were used on songs that had string sections originally, such as "Rudy," "A Soapbox Opera" and "Crime of the Century."

~Ben

 

[Rudy]

I don't know, I thought Paris was a horrible release. The performances were all lackluster. I had high hopes when I bought that LP and was thoroughly bummed after listening to it.

I never cared for it either (I just felt it sounded rushed and a bit sloppy), but sometimes restoring the proper setlist puts it into a newer perspective, the way The Who's Live at Leeds was reassembled to cover the whole gig. I think I played Paris once, and only two or three sides of it, and haven't touched it since. That was one of a few that really soured me on live albums in general.

What is amazing to me is how those concerts actually sound in hindsight. I have the two-disc CD released from Peter Gabriel's "Growing Up Again" tour of smaller venues, and every moment is captured with no retouching. The technical errors of the concert remained (the stage partially lost power at the start of "Solsbury Hill", and Peter performed "Here Comes The Flood" by himself while they fixed the problems), and one or two flubs or missed notes...stuff we didn't notice during the concert itself.

 

[jfiedler17]

Yeah, I haven't listened to Paris myself in a really long time, either. Some of the songs come off really well (especially "Dreamer", which, if memory serves me right, actually belatedly became a Top 40 hit in its live form from this album), but overall, it's not the greatest of live albums, but I think part of that is due to the sequencing. "Two of Us" and "Crime of the Century" in particular seem to end the album on a really anticlimactic note and seem like strange choices to close the disc, much in the same way that Paul McCartney's Wings Over America album ultimately ends on a bizarre note due to the choice of "Soily" to close the disc. But then, there's not a heck of a lot of live albums I've listened to more than once, even by artists I really like, so I can't really say I'm a big live-album buff. I also - and I'm sure I'm in a minority on this one - tend to be the most intrigued by live albums that are more intimate and either recast the songs in radically different ways (doing them "unplugged"-style or even a-cappella, like Joe Jackson's a-cappella reworking of "Is She Really Going Out with Him?" on Live 1980/1986) and/or feature the performer introducing numbers or engaging with the crowd or even cracking jokes inbetween songs, like on Peter Allen's It Is Time for Peter Allen or Bruce Cockburn's Slice 'o Life or CSNY's 4 Way Street. Those kind of live albums tend to stick with me more.

 

[Benjamin Edge]

Yeah, I haven't listened to Paris myself in a really long time, either. Some of the songs come off really well (especially "Dreamer", which, if memory serves me right, actually belatedly became a Top 40 hit in its live form from this album), but overall, it's not the greatest of live albums, but I think part of that is due to the sequencing. "Two of Us" and "Crime of the Century" in particular seem to end the album on a really anticlimactic note and seem like strange choices to close the disc, much in the same way that Paul McCartney's Wings Over America album ultimately ends on a bizarre note due to the choice of "Soily" to close the disc. But then, there's not a heck of a lot of live albums I've listened to more than once, even by artists I really like, so I can't really say I'm a big live-album buff. I also - and I'm sure I'm in a minority on this one - tend to be the most intrigued by live albums that are more intimate and either recast the songs in radically different ways (doing them "unplugged"-style or even a-cappella, like Joe Jackson's a-cappella reworking of "Is She Really Going Out with Him?" on Live 1980/1986) and/or feature the performer introducing numbers or engaging with the crowd or even cracking jokes inbetween songs, like on Peter Allen's It Is Time for Peter Allen or Bruce Cockburn's Slice 'o Life or CSNY's 4 Way Street. Those kind of live albums tend to stick with me more.

Yes, "Dreamer" (a track originally from Crime of the Century) peaked at no. 15 on the Billboard Hot 100 here the week ending November 8, 1980. Another single culled from Paris was a rendition of "Breakfast in America," the only such stateside charting of a track originally from the band's 1979 studio album of the same name of which this live album coincided with the success of, stalled at no. 62 on the Hot 100 the week ending December 27, 1980.

Also, the live rendition of "Crime of the Century" ends on a somewhat climactic note; as all the synthesizers fade out and the crowd starts cheering, the opening harmonica from the studio version of "School" plays during these final few seconds.

~Ben

 

[Rudy]

I'm going to spin the MoFi Crime Of The Century shortly--now I'm inspired.

 

[jfiedler17]

Actually, going back and listening to it, I'd have to concede that it ends on a stronger note than I used to think. I still think "Two of Us" is a little awkwardly placed, but "Crime of the Century" is a good note to go out on. I also noticed that all their other live albums similarly end with that one, so that must be a traditional show-closer for them. (I've never actually had the privilege of seeing them live myself.)

How is Live '88? That's the only one of their A&M-era releases I've never heard. While I'm a big Hodgson fan, I do still find a lot to like in the studio albums the band cut for A&M after he left (Brother Where You Bound and Free As a Bird; "Ever Open Door" and "I'm Beggin' You" are probably my favorite cuts from those two), but the live album I've been a bit wary to seek out a copy of and give a try, if just 'cause of the potential awkwardness of hearing Roger's songs sung by somebody other than himself, which I think would be sorta like listening to one of the latter-day Styx live albums with Lawrence Gowan singing all of the old Dennis songs that they've kept in their act.

 

[Michael DIsa]

There was a Supertramp Boxset. The box was call "A&M Records - The Compact Collection" UPC 082839690027 In a Black Slipcase only containing the album versions of all 9 Supertramp albums (10 CDs) through Brother Where You Bound. I purchased it either 1986 or 1987 in Manhattan, in the day when you saw something you bought it as if you left, when you came back it would be gone. As far as a comprehensive set I don't believe it will happen with the animosity between Roger and Rick. Especially with Rick's insistance of playing Roger's songs on tour in contradiction to their agreement when the split occured.

 

[Dave]

I don't know, I thought Paris was a horrible release. The performances were all lackluster. I had high hopes when I bought that LP and was thoroughly bummed after listening to it. I stopped listening to Supertramp after that debacle. Their studio albums were great but they couldn't reproduce that sound in concert.

Capt. Bacardi

Paris was the typical climactic moment when after a stab at probably company-prompted Live album, that nothing really in terms of the studio-work that followed, was really quite as good (if a few exceptional albums have their moments, offering at least one or two good songs)...

Something at least containing the "lost material" would reignite the spark of this group that is still a favorite of many here, including mine (and have to wince at the thought of more than-30-years-long ago, my drawing of this group hanging on one of my classroom walls w/ the name above it, (actually very much the Black & White spread in my Song Hits magazine that wasn't even in front of me when I drew it) caught the attention of a fellow-student shouting it out (to the sound of 'SuperFLY'!) as he'd noticed it, while in my modesty tried my best not to appear "guilty")...


-- Dave

 

[Mike Blakesley]

It's too bad the box-set era is ending. I like box sets -- although I'm pretty picky about whose box set I'll buy.

The most obvious omission from A&M is the Tijuana Brass...They're only one the biggest selling acts the label ever had. But yeah -- Styx and Supertramp should have had one too.

 

[Rudy]

Actually box sets are all the rage lately, but gone are the days of expensive sets. Nowadays when they are first released, the cost per disc is often $3-$4 for a "complete" artist box set. My 9 album Bill Withers box cost me $28, shipped. The Brubeck Complete Studio Recordings box was similarly priced, and someone else (Dylan?) had a big box set released before the holidays. A couple of years ago it was the massive Miles Davis set.

Beyond that are the budget priced "classic albums" sets, combining five of an artist's popular albums in one package. Slightly different are the Dionne Warwick sets I just had shipped in from the UK. Four sets, four albums in each set, 9 CDs total. Cost per album was a bit higher, but I ended up with 16 albums for just over $60 US total. Amazon.UK has a lot of all of these sets, it's a great time to build up the collection! Sony/Legacy and Warner/Rhino are deep into it.

For these sets or the larger box sets, they tend to use the most recent masterings to save cost. The big "complete" box sets usually have a nice annotated booklet inside. All are in mini LP sleeves. Yes it's cheap, but also cheap to produce, distribute and stock. The Dionne sets are in DigiPaks, and all have very complete booklet notes inside.

But despite all this, it feels like one last grasp at the CD market. The days of lavishly produced box sets, for the most part, are behind us, but right now the pickings are excellent for these cheaper boxes.

 

[Benjamin Edge]

We're still waiting for the original versions of "Land Ho" and "You Started Laughing (When I Held You In My Arms)" to be released on CD. These are both non-album songs.

~Ben

 

[Michael DIsa]

For a Live set you need to check out "Is Everybody Listening" from a Cleveland '76 show it show 'tramp at their best. I know it has no Breakfast snogs but as a document of their live talents it speaks volumes.

 

[Michael DIsa]

Has anyone ever thought of when Supertramp will ever release a box set of its material through A&M (from 1970-88)?

The group's studio albums:
* Supertramp (1970; U.S. release 1977)
* Indelibly Stamped (1971)
* Crime of the Century (1974)
* Crisis? What Crisis? (1975)
* Even in the Quietest Moments (1977)
* Breakfast in America (1979)
* ... Famous Last Words ... (1982)
* Brother Where You Bound? (1985)
* Free as a Bird (1987)

Live albums:
* Paris (1980)
* Live '88 (1988)

Compilations:
Classics, Vol. 9 (1987)
The Very Best of Supertramp (1992; U.S. release 2001) (similar to Classics Vol. 9 except for the addition of "School," which leads the CD)
The Very Best of Supertramp, Vol. 2 (1993)
Retrospectacle: The Supertramp Anthology (2005; also known as Supertramp: Gold)

Lost material wanted:
"Land Ho" (early version with seagull intro)
"Land Ho" (original 1974 single release)
"School" (demo version)
"Bloody Well Right" (demo version)
"Dreamer" (1968 Roger Hodgson demo version)
"Rudy" (with Wurlitzer piano track and flute track)
"You Started Laughing (When I Held You in My Arms)" (1975) (original version; was B-side to "Lady" single)
"The Logical Song" (demo version)
"The Logical Song" (extended version, longer than the 4:08 album version)
"Goodbye Stranger" (demo version)
"Goodbye Stranger" (extended version, longer than the 5:47 album version)
"Take the Long Way Home" (extended version, longer than the 5:02 album version)
"Breakfast in America" (1968 Roger Hodgson demo version with his harmonium called "Grandma")
"It's Raining Again" (1968 Roger Hodgson demo version)

The recording of "Land Ho" which is track 3 on Retrospectacle is a 1975 remake which was intended to be released on the Crisis? What Crisis? LP. Roger Hodgson re-recorded the song himself for release on his 1987 solo album, Hai Hai.

The second disc of the Breakfast in America (Deluxe Edition) CD set is all live recordings. Most of those performances were done at the same show that made up the 16 tracks for the Paris live double-album, including "Goodbye Stranger," "Even in the Quietest Moments" and "Child of Vision."

In effect, there could easily have been a Paris Deluxe Edition version spanning three discs, which is an amalgam of the 16 songs off the original 2-LP/2-CD set and the songs off the second CD from the BIA Deluxe album, but using the proper order per the set list. The venue in question was the Pavillon de Paris, on November 29-30, 1979.

~Ben

Just a quick note - anything recorded after "...Famous Last Words..." is Supertramp in name only as after Roger left it was not the same band.

 

[david Mendenhall]

You should add the demo of "Ever Open Door". Roger has personally told me it was originally recorded as a duet during the Famous Last Words sessions.

 

[david Mendenhall]

For a Live set you need to check out "Is Everybody Listening" from a Cleveland '76 show it show 'tramp at their best. I know it has no Breakfast snogs but as a document of their live talents it speaks volumes.

Note: that recording is actually a Hammersmith show from London recorded On Sunday, March 9th in 1975. It soon will be re- released as the 2nd disc of the "Crime Of The Century" Deluxe set out later this year.

 

[david Mendenhall]

For a Live set you need to check out "Is Everybody Listening" from a Cleveland '76 show it show 'tramp at their best. I know it has no Breakfast snogs but as a document of their live talents it speaks volumes.

Be advised, that show is actually the Hammersmith show that is coming out this Devember.