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The Singles 1969-1973 SACD and SHM (New Releases)

Rick-An Ordinary Fool

Well-Known Member
Thread Starter
What I am about to speak of is pertaining to The Singles 69-73 SHM SACD

I've really been enjoying my Singles 69-73 SACD and today I wondered why can't I capture the audio from the 2 channels while it's playing in DSD mode and be able to enjoy it in my car or on put it in my iTunes. So today, I ran a splitter (rca connector L&R on one end and mini stereo jack on the other) unplugged the left & right speakers and plugged into this rca splitter and plugged the mini stereo jack into my laptop and captured the audio using Audacity, all while the Singles 69-73 SACD was playing in DSD mode 2 ch stereo.

It took awhile because I not only had to play the entire disc for the capture but then had to go and label and split the tracks with audacity. I managed to split them all so that they match all the original length and since some seque into one another had to be sure to split them at the exact spot. So while I'm doing all this...I'm thinking it's probably going to sound pretty much like the Singles 69-73 SHM CD. Boy was I wrong.

So I imported my rip from the 2 ch SACD into my iTunes library and I'm comparing the sound back and forth between the SHM-CD and the SHM-SACD. While the SHM CD was ripped using iTunes at 320 kbps, the SHM-SACD was ripped using audacity at 320 kbps.

So the benefit in all of this is that I can now listen to the SHM-SACD in my car or on my iPod. I know what I ripped is not the same exact quality as what you actually hear in DSD mode but it sure sounds pretty close. The rip I made of the SACD just sounds so much better, the bass, guitar all highlighted with more definition and even Karen's vocal seems just a bit stronger to me. The sound of the instruments seem stronger yet don't overpower the song and the bass just sounds deeper and stronger, more emphasis but without overpowering the track. While the SHM CD is warm sounding and not mastered loudly, the rip I made of the 2 Ch SACD just sounds better overall, it retains the warmth but also sounds fuller like what you think stereo should sound like. It's almost like your listening to the actual master tape, it's that clean and bright without any harshness or any loudness wars. What I'm hearing from my 2 Ch SACD rip really is a step above (sonically) to the SHM-CD. I'm really happy that I spent the time today to do this today.

I was so impressed with the above^ that I plan to do the same thing on a couple SHM-SACD's of Olivia that are also 2 Ch Stereo. This way I can enjoy those titles as well in my car and iPod.
 

Jeff

Well-Known Member
Uhhh, you did what? I'm clueless technically but how cool sacd is car worthy. Not 10 min ago I was asking Mr Man if newer car stereos play sacd? A jingle to CarToys is on the horizon. Speaking of HORIZON!!! That sacd would cause the blind to see, lame walk and me to wet my pants...no really...isn't that the yardstick commonly used?

Jeff
 

Guitarmutt

Well-Known Member
That is very cool, and again I am intrigued. I have professional grade recording equipment hooked into my sound system, and I routinely dub and/or record from otherwise unobtainable sources, tho blu-ray is still tricky.

I really should just throw down for this release just to hear the difference for myself with my own ears before it disappears until the next anniversary.
 

Rick-An Ordinary Fool

Well-Known Member
Thread Starter
I've been listening to this rip I made direct from the DSD SHM-SACD Singles 69-73 and this has to be the best sounding Singles 69-73 that I own...it even outshines the audiophile LP of this title and something has to be great to pass up that audiophile LP as that was always a top contender for me. This rip is so great in my opinion that I'm almost tempted to cancel my pre-order of the UK Singles SHM-CD and just get the UK SHM-SACD and rip the SACD just like I did above. This way I get the SACD and I can rip the 2 ch stereo DSD for my car and ipod. I'm listening to it right now....I should be in bed but Karen has me captivated yet again....this has really turned into a fabulous 2014 if I say so myself....more Carpenters goodies than I can imagine happening and it's not even June 25th yet, more love yet to come....
 

Ted Etheridge

Well-Known Member
I wonder if Richard believes this format is dead because he no longer has access to his first gen multitrack tapes to issue more releases OR do all artists & record labels believe this format is dead? This is what I'd like to know....why are there still so many SACD's still being released if the format is dead? Yes the format is a small niche in the community but people are still buying them and retail outlets must be able to report back sales to the record labels and if something is selling why not produce the product.

Chris, do you believe that we will get more albums on the 2 ch stereo SACD's since we seem to be getting 2 already or do you think it will end with the Singles comp's?
 

Ted Etheridge

Well-Known Member
I wonder if Richard believes this format is dead because he no longer has access to his first gen multitrack tapes to issue more releases OR do all artists & record labels believe this format is dead? This is what I'd like to know....why are there still so many SACD's still being released if the format is dead? Yes the format is a small niche in the community but people are still buying them and retail outlets must be able to report back sales to the record labels and if something is selling why not produce the product.

Chris, do you believe that we will get more albums on the 2 ch stereo SACD's since we seem to be getting 2 already or do you think it will end with the Singles comp's?
According to the article in Stereo Review I read a few months back, they still are in demand and the people who are buying them still have some market. I also read that there are other ways to deliver high quality sound over the internet for those who like high end resolution. I don't see why they don't jump on that and make a few dollars. I personally prefer to have the actual disc but would download a remix or a remaster from HD tracks or some other service offering the service. You gotta use what is available.
 

Rick-An Ordinary Fool

Well-Known Member
Thread Starter
Bringing back a somewhat older topic....I've just noticed that The Singles 69-73 SHM-SACD is now out of print/stock, CD Japan is no longer showing it for sale. I'm not sure when it went out of print/stock, now copies are only available through online sellers like ebay and the like. I just did a quick search of ebay for this SACD and there are only 3 currently for sale and prices are ranging from $125.00, $130.00, $131.00.
 
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Rudy

¡Que siga la fiesta!
Staff member
Site Admin
According to the article in Stereo Review I read a few months back, they still are in demand and the people who are buying them still have some market. I also read that there are other ways to deliver high quality sound over the internet for those who like high end resolution. I don't see why they don't jump on that and make a few dollars. I personally prefer to have the actual disc but would download a remix or a remaster from HD tracks or some other service offering the service. You gotta use what is available.

HDTracks, far as I know, is still selling primarily PCM digital files, up to 24bit/192kHz. But Acoustic Sounds is now offering online DSD digital file downloads. Thing is, support for it is not too strong yet--there isn't much hardware that can play it. Even my Oppo BDP-105 can only play standard DSD--the higher sampling rate DSD files though, do not have much available. You typically need a DAC (digital to analog converter) that can handle DSD, or drivers for a computer that can at least read the files. My Oppo only plays DSD via USB, not the network, so even there, it's limited.

It's apples and oranges though, as to which sounds better. DSD definitely can sound better since overall it has a higher data rate, but like anything it depends on how well the title was mastered. Same with HDTracks PCM downloads. Universal released a "remastered" version of Nirvana's Nevermind which is the worst version of that album I have ever heard.

Acoustic SOunds is primarily selling the DSD files that were released on US SACDs. Ones which we've seen already. HDTracks does have the Singles SACD contents, but only in PCM digital. Differences between that and the SACD are likely so small as to be meaningless to most people.

SACD is doing quite well otherwise. Many audiophile labels are releasing titles on SACD now. The latest for my wish list is the Stevie Ray Vaughan set from Analogue Productions, but since they have it on vinyl (all analog, directly from the master tapes), I would be more inclined to go that route. But it's nice to have that choice of SACD or vinyl--fans can buy whichever format they prefer.
 

Eyewire

Well-Known Member
I ordered the The Singles 1969-1973 Platinum SHM-CD from CDJapan and am waiting for it to arrive. I live in a small apartment and don't have room to setup a surround sound system, and even if I did, my walls are so thin I don't want to disturb my neighbours. Therefore, I do all of my listening through headphones. With these restrictions, is it worth getting the SACD as well? I see them on eBay for quite a bit of money, but if the sound quality is that much better even through headphones, then I might consider buying a copy. Of course, I'd have to then get a SACD-capable player as well.
 

Eyewire

Well-Known Member
Oops. Upon more careful reading of this thread, I just realized that the SACD of The Singles 1969-1973 is not multi-channel. So I guess the SHM-CD will do for now.
 

Chris May

Resident 'Carpenterologist'
Staff member
Moderator
And while we're at it, Amazon is listing it at a pretty hefty penny as well...

Singles SACD - DSD.png
 

Harry

Charter A&M Corner Member
Staff member
Site Admin
This release will likely be in a standard-type jewel case rather than the elaborate box/mini LP packaging of the original from April of 2014.
 

Eyewire

Well-Known Member
Browsing that link, I've been thinking about acquiring this set or the SHM-CD with the mini-LP reproduction sleeve. Do you guys enjoy the set? Is the sound quality worth it?

Did you ever get the SACD? I have it but can’t comment on the SQ because I don’t have a SACD player, but the SHM-CD sounds great. But then, the older Remastered Classic version sounds great too!

And now I see they will be releasing this title in yet another format, Hi-Res CD (MQA x UHQCD):

The Singles 1969 - 1973 [Hi-Res CD (MQA x UHQCD)] [Limited Release] Carpenters CD Album

Anyone know what the advantage of this new format is?
 

theninjarabbit

Well-Known Member
Did you ever get the SACD? I have it but can’t comment on the SQ because I don’t have a SACD player, but the SHM-CD sounds great. But then, the older Remastered Classic version sounds great too!

And now I see they will be releasing this title in yet another format, Hi-Res CD (MQA x UHQCD):

The Singles 1969 - 1973 [Hi-Res CD (MQA x UHQCD)] [Limited Release] Carpenters CD Album

Anyone know what the advantage of this new format is?

Yep! I did. The poor thing languishes in its CD case because I, too, lack a way to play it. I tried every Sony Blu-Ray player I have access to (I've scuffed the jewel case a bit traveling with it :whistle:). Someday I'll get to spin it and enjoy every minute of it.

After the experience with a slightly obscure audio format, I think I'm just gonna stick with what I have...and not get dazzled by fancy acronyms :D
 

Mike Blakesley

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Moderator
Some of the advantages of these new formats are so miniscule compared to the original that they almost seem like just a cash grab to me.

I'd be more likely to buy a new iteration of a favorite album if it came with a new booklet with fresh content in a jazzed-up package of some sort. But then I'm more of a packaging fan than I am an audiophile.
 

Harry

Charter A&M Corner Member
Staff member
Site Admin
I bought the SACD of SINGLES 1969-1981 (golly I wished they'd given that a different title since it's not the same as the 2000 CD!) long before I had a way to at least sample the upgraded sound. Finding that my Sony Blu-ray (BDP-570) handles SACD, I was at least able to listen to a 3.0 version of it, since I never hooked up rear surrounds here in Florida.

I also bought the SHM-SACD of SINGLES 1969-1973 and found that to be an exceptional way to listen to that old album. The Platinum SHM-CD is also good, but not really exceptionally better than any other CD format that I can tell. I've also got several special iterations of GOLD, a K2HD, and an LPCD45 version that are supposed to sound great. They do - but again, nothing special that I can hear.
 

tomswift2002

Well-Known Member
Did you ever get the SACD? I have it but can’t comment on the SQ because I don’t have a SACD player, but the SHM-CD sounds great. But then, the older Remastered Classic version sounds great too!

And now I see they will be releasing this title in yet another format, Hi-Res CD (MQA x UHQCD):

The Singles 1969 - 1973 [Hi-Res CD (MQA x UHQCD)] [Limited Release] Carpenters CD Album

Anyone know what the advantage of this new format is?
This is from obseletemedia.org (which seems to be condensed version of what CDJapan has about UHQCD):
UHQCD is a type of audio Compact Disc introduced by Memory-Tech in Japan in 2015, and is a development of the HQCD (High Quality Compact Disc) introduced six years previously. UHQCD discs conform to Red Book standards and are playable in any audio CD player. They don’t contain any more audio information than a standard CD, but it is claimed that a higher-quality manufacturing process and higher quality materials in the reflective layer produces higher precision audio reproduction.

A photopolymer is used instead of standard polycarbonate, since in their liquid state photopolymers achieve better replication of the pits on the CD stamper.

Really, this sounds like the "HD" of Vinyl thing, but for CD's. I'm not sure how a better reflective layer is going to help provide better audio reproduction. Might help after a few years when the disc has numerous scratches on it from general play, but I mean we are talking about something where the better audio reproduction is going to be from the mastering of the tracks, or an all-new format that can handle higher-quality audio, just like Blu-Ray can handle , even for standard definition video, a file with a higher bitrate than a DVD can, which results in a better image.
 

ullalume

Well-Known Member
I own the SACD singles '69-'81 but I'm intrigued. . .does the opening instrumental piece leading into WOJG feature standard stereo, or has it also received the SACD treatment? I'm guessing not but thought I'd ask.
 

Harry

Charter A&M Corner Member
Staff member
Site Admin
I own the SACD singles '69-'81 but I'm intrigued. . .does the opening instrumental piece leading into WOJG feature standard stereo, or has it also received the SACD treatment? I'm guessing not but thought I'd ask.

The SINGLES 1969-1973 SHM-SACD was never intended to be a "surround" disc like the other SACD was. It was always intended to be just 2-channel stereo, just like the original album. The fact that it's an SACD doesn't demand that it be surround. The surround capability of an SACD is simply an offshoot - something that the format "permits" but is not necessarily required. The main idea of an SACD is the higher resolution that the format permits.

This particular Japanese release from back in 2014 came in three flavors: The most expensive was an SHM-SACD. So it was an SACD (in stereo) made in the higher-quality polymer known as SHM.

Next there was a Platinum CD made of the SHM material. This had a platinum metal base inside and was coated with the SHM polymer. It's a standard CD that plays in most players, although they cautioned that some old players might balk at it.

Finally in that series was a standard aluminum SHM CD.

The packaging on the two higher-level versions was a bit special and never got much acknowledgement at the time. I've taken the time to separate all of the elements of the SHM-SACD for a photo.

SHM-SACD.jpg


From left-top, there's the outer box, then the wrap-around outer-obi, and the main jacket for the album, fitted with a mini-vinyl-obi.

Lower row from left is the actual CD laying on its cloth protective sleeve, a mini-reprint of the album's booklet with two gold stickers saved from the outer package, and finally the Japanese booklet with liner notes in Japanese and the inevitable lyrics.
 

ullalume

Well-Known Member
The SINGLES 1969-1973 SHM-SACD was never intended to be a "surround" disc like the other SACD was. It was always intended to be just 2-channel stereo, just like the original album. The fact that it's an SACD doesn't demand that it be surround. The surround capability of an SACD is simply an offshoot - something that the format "permits" but is not necessarily required. The main idea of an SACD is the higher resolution that the format permits.

This particular Japanese release from back in 2014 came in three flavors: The most expensive was an SHM-SACD. So it was an SACD (in stereo) made in the higher-quality polymer known as SHM.

Next there was a Platinum CD made of the SHM material. This had a platinum metal base inside and was coated with the SHM polymer. It's a standard CD that plays in most players, although they cautioned that some old players might balk at it.

Finally in that series was a standard aluminum SHM CD.

The packaging on the two higher-level versions was a bit special and never got much acknowledgement at the time. I've taken the time to separate all of the elements of the SHM-SACD for a photo.

SHM-SACD.jpg


From left-top, there's the outer box, then the wrap-around outer-obi, and the main jacket for the album, fitted with a mini-vinyl-obi.

Lower row from left is the actual CD laying on its cloth protective sleeve, a mini-reprint of the album's booklet with two gold stickers saved from the outer package, and finally the Japanese booklet with liner notes in Japanese and the inevitable lyrics.

Cheers Harry. . . .so that's a no on the opening being split into 5.1, then?
 

tomswift2002

Well-Known Member
You have to wonder why The Singles 1969-1973 keeps getting released on all these new formats. You would assume that As Time Goes By might get a release considering that it was big hit on the Japanese charts, and some of the recordings would reflect the better resolutions that have come since the 70's (recordings like California Dreaming and The Rainbow Connection, sure Karen's lead vocals would be from tapes from the 60's to 80's, the rest of the recordings would be from tapes and machines of the late-90's that offered more resolution).
 
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