richard_sloat
Member
Chris-An Ordinary Fool said:
It was certainly staged, the timing of their coming out was too perfect and they are already smiling as they do.
Why wasn't (Want You) Back In My Life Again a bigger hit?
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It was certainly staged, the timing of their coming out was too perfect and they are already smiling as they do.
andywithaz
Well-Known Member
Wow, this turned into a nice little discussion. Reminds me of the A&M Corner of years past.
Anyway, I'm not at all surprised by any of the answers. However, a few members have said that it probably failed in 1981 as a hit single even though being catchy, because the song was corny. Ironic, because I feel that Please Mr. Postman is the corniest song besides Goofus. Interesting that Please Mr. Postman charted a #1 position just 7 years back. My my, how taste changed so fast back then.
Anyway, I'm not at all surprised by any of the answers. However, a few members have said that it probably failed in 1981 as a hit single even though being catchy, because the song was corny. Ironic, because I feel that Please Mr. Postman is the corniest song besides Goofus. Interesting that Please Mr. Postman charted a #1 position just 7 years back. My my, how taste changed so fast back then.
BarryT60
Well-Known Member
Ah! Don't get me started on Goofus! I remember calling A & M regularly to get the pre-release information from marketing - - on new singles... (1976 stalker!) and when she was saying the release date was set for the new single - I tried to guess the tune.... You was my first choice... I Can't smile Without You, my second... The girl said 'no'... I Have You, I asked? 'No'... I resorted to another one I wasn;t in love with, Boat to Sail? "No" she commented.... I got to Goofus - and said, surely not Goofus... she said, Yup! And i sunk down to the bottom of my hard wooden desk chair in my bedroom and said to myself... 'This album is over'.... I was shell-shocked.... 'night!
raz42289 said:
It's hard to realize when we're dealing with such huge chunks of time in a forum like this (A&M is only 2 years away from it's 50th anniversary), but musical tastes rarely stay the same over a 7-year span.
Take "Please Mr. Postman". That was 1974. Seven years before that was 1967. Monkees, Buckinghams, Rolling Stones, Supremes, Beatles, Turtles, Nancy and Frank Sinatra, The Young Rascals, Aretha Franklin, The Association, The Doors, Bobbie Gentry, Box Tops, Lulu and the Strawberry Alarm Clock were the artists with #1 hits that year. Very different.
Back seven years from that and you're at 1960. Marty Robbins, Johnny Preston, Mark Dinning, Percy Faith, Elvis, The Everly Brothers, Connie Francis, The Hollywood Argyles, Brenda Lee, Brian Hyland, Chubby Checker, Larry Verne, The Drifters, Ray Charles and Maurice Williams and the Zodiacs were the #1 hitmakers.
And "Postman" was the beginning of a trend (something we don't usually associate with Carpenters)...an updated remake of a 60s oldie. The following year, Linda Ronstadt began a string of hits along the same lines (The Everly Brothers' "When Will I Be Loved", going to Motown as the Carpenters did for Martha and the Vandellas' "Heat Wave" and Smokey & The Miracles "Tracks of My Tears", Buddy Holly's "That'll Be The Day", Roy Orbison's "Blue Bayou", back to Buddy Holly for "It's So Easy", then on to Chuck Berry's "Back In The USA", Smokey again for "Ooh Baby Baby", Doris Troy's "Just One Look", Little Anthony & The Imperials' "Hurt So Bad" and the Hollies' "I Can't Let Go." That filled five years for Linda.
James Taylor jumped on the bandwagon with "How Sweet It Is (To Be Loved By You)" and "Handy Man"...and the Captain & Tenille did "Shop Around.
So...corny...maybe...but K&R hit on something the American public really wanted in the mid-70s.
Actually, I may have given K&R a bit too much credit for starting the 60s oldies remake trend. Ringo was ahead of them with "You're Sixteen" as was Grand Funk with "The Loco-Motion" (but did the oldies medley on Now & Then influence those records?).
Regardless, they were among the leaders, and, apart from "A Kind Of Hush", didn't follow after others like Linda showed how much gold there was in...um...gold.
Regardless, they were among the leaders, and, apart from "A Kind Of Hush", didn't follow after others like Linda showed how much gold there was in...um...gold.
Many people call "Touch Me When We're Dancing" a big hit or a comeback. But really if you look at it realistically it was somewhat a failure. This was their first pop single over 2 1/2 years. it was billed as their comeback and then it only peaked at #16 and was followed up by three songs which did not make the top 40. If it was a comeback, it was a comeback with no legs.
I always felt Karen's voice on "Touch Me When We're Dancing" was way to high and the song itself just didn't have any real verve. It lacked the energy Carpenters had on songs such as Solitaire" or "Road Ode".
On ("Want You) Back In My Life Again" the song was just not a great record. At best it's a cute song with a fluffy little rhythm. It's fine as album filler, but not quite what was in the mode for single release in 1981-82.
I think overall "Made In America" was lacking in hit material. The album just did not contain that Carpenters magic which was so prevalent on albums such as "A song For You" or "Horizon".
Someone mentioned that "Kiss me The Way You did Last Night" may have made a better single. I would say even that song would have not made top 40, it is just way too fluffy. I hate to put it this way but it's too "girly" sounding. I always found this song to be a turn off.
I always felt Karen's voice on "Touch Me When We're Dancing" was way to high and the song itself just didn't have any real verve. It lacked the energy Carpenters had on songs such as Solitaire" or "Road Ode".
On ("Want You) Back In My Life Again" the song was just not a great record. At best it's a cute song with a fluffy little rhythm. It's fine as album filler, but not quite what was in the mode for single release in 1981-82.
I think overall "Made In America" was lacking in hit material. The album just did not contain that Carpenters magic which was so prevalent on albums such as "A song For You" or "Horizon".
Someone mentioned that "Kiss me The Way You did Last Night" may have made a better single. I would say even that song would have not made top 40, it is just way too fluffy. I hate to put it this way but it's too "girly" sounding. I always found this song to be a turn off.
JAZZ4JEFF
Active Member
I think the easiest reason for the failure of "Made in America" was the album did not reflect the times. Disco was over and the music scene was changing. The Carpenters trademark sound did not. Remember in 1981, Barry Manilow, Neil Diamond, and Barbra Streisand were also not heating up the charts.
It's funny, I heard the 1978 Doobie Brothers hit "What a fool believes" on the radio today and "I want you back in my life again" sounded like a clone of that record. Same type of piano riff. Maybe it was an inspiration?
Play Robbie Dupree's "Steal away", along side the aforementioned recordings by the Doobie Brothers & The Carpenters, and you'll hear the similarities. I am not saving there was any plagiarism here, just similar feel & style.
It's funny, I heard the 1978 Doobie Brothers hit "What a fool believes" on the radio today and "I want you back in my life again" sounded like a clone of that record. Same type of piano riff. Maybe it was an inspiration?
Play Robbie Dupree's "Steal away", along side the aforementioned recordings by the Doobie Brothers & The Carpenters, and you'll hear the similarities. I am not saving there was any plagiarism here, just similar feel & style.
BarryT60
Well-Known Member
I was thrilled with new music from these guys - and was fairly enthralled with Touch - - with the exception of them suddenly using back-up singers. To me - even more than Karen's higher notes, the background singers were a distraction or a 'miss' for the record.
A bit off topic for this thread - but in a way - it relates... In doing some discography research on the timing of single releases, I realized that "If I Had You" was the last charted single (AC chart) that hit the top 20... from Karen's album release in 96... Kinda cool....
A bit off topic for this thread - but in a way - it relates... In doing some discography research on the timing of single releases, I realized that "If I Had You" was the last charted single (AC chart) that hit the top 20... from Karen's album release in 96... Kinda cool....
That's very funny. Yup - it sure is..... Have a great Friday evening!
Melissa Manchester, who certainly wasn't regarded as a cutting-edge artist, had a big hit around this same time with "You Should Hear How She Talks About You", which is not unlike this song - but it drives harder, with a stronger beat and early 80's snare sound - I actually think a more aggressive production might have helped this song do better. My two cents, worth exactly that much!
Soft, wimpy retreadings of three-year old records wasn't going to do anything for anybody in '81.
Remember, it took "Physical" to get Olivia out of the ditch in '82. And besides being a driving dance record with a monster hook, it was a massive image change for Olivia, from wide-eyed breathless ("I Honestly Love You") to heart-broken country queen ("Please Mr. Please", "Dancing 'Round And 'Round)....to "rip my spandex off and let's party."
When you consider that strong, agressive female artists (Joan Jett, Pat Benatar) were the new vogue, I don't know where Karen could have gone. I can't picture her having beaten Joan Jett to "Do You Want To Touch Me".
Remember, it took "Physical" to get Olivia out of the ditch in '82. And besides being a driving dance record with a monster hook, it was a massive image change for Olivia, from wide-eyed breathless ("I Honestly Love You") to heart-broken country queen ("Please Mr. Please", "Dancing 'Round And 'Round)....to "rip my spandex off and let's party."
When you consider that strong, agressive female artists (Joan Jett, Pat Benatar) were the new vogue, I don't know where Karen could have gone. I can't picture her having beaten Joan Jett to "Do You Want To Touch Me".
song4u
Well-Known Member
Oh I loved that MM song - the whole album, actually. Another incredible voice.
I had waited and waited for K and R to put out another record (we fans had no idea all the turmoil going on in their personal lives). But I found this whole album to be a let down. I don't know what I was expecting, but this wasn't it. I never liked the OK Chorale - reminded me of the Ray Coniff singers. I think it would have been wise to put in Seidah Garrett's backing vocals on the whole album, mixed with K and R to get a fuller sound.
Just my 2 cents.
BarryT60
Well-Known Member
wow - I am thinking I want to go (re) listen to this whole album! Objectively, I remember thinking at the time - it was a 'pretty' album. Some awkward moments melodically to TGOD, and I never cared for some of the trumpet in SOAW - really didn't like the message of the song lyrically either... WYBIML seemed like okay album filler, the next few were very pretty songs, then we have Touch - which high notes or not, was the best attempt at moving into the 80s here... beech was not too substantive either... I do like When it's Gone... as a possible Country follow-up to Sweet Sweet Smile... And Somebody's been Lyin' is beautifully performed.
As for where they 'should' have gone musically? That's something to ponder....
Obviously, a standards album could have been worthwhile - in the vein of Natalie Cole... I would have loved to have heard Karen's voice on one of those Disney animated feature film title songs - like Celine in Beauty and the Beast....
But at the end of the day - - anything they could serve up - either sub-par or classic - would have been so much easier on the ears than so much of the 80's crap that came our way.....
As for where they 'should' have gone musically? That's something to ponder....
Obviously, a standards album could have been worthwhile - in the vein of Natalie Cole... I would have loved to have heard Karen's voice on one of those Disney animated feature film title songs - like Celine in Beauty and the Beast....
But at the end of the day - - anything they could serve up - either sub-par or classic - would have been so much easier on the ears than so much of the 80's crap that came our way.....
BarryT60 said:
A standards album would have been a good move for them. "I Can Dream, Can't I" from HORIZON would have been the template.
They'd have been 8 years behind the true pioneer, Harry Nilsson's A LITTLE TOUCH OF SCHMILSSON IN THE NIGHT, but a year ahead of Carly Simon's TORCH and Linda Ronstadt's trio of LPs with Nelson Riddle....to say nothing of Barry Manilow and Rod Stewart.
Rick-An Ordinary Fool
Well-Known Member
Michael Hagerty said:
Olivia is a great example here, she has said in many interviews around the time Physical came out that you have to continue to re-invent your self as an artist but you have to feel good about the change in your music. There was a good morning america interview I believe in 1981 of her and the host said the record Physical is a big change in direction in your music from I honesty love you to this, she says yes it is more rock. The clip is on u tube. She talked about cutting off her long hair etc... She's also told the story over and over about how nervous she was when the song Physical was released and how she at the last min wanted to pull the song from radio because she thought it was too risk-ey and she was afraid how the public would react. I believe the song was even banned in Utah stations. She decided it would be best to tone it down a little and make the Physical video funny.
But it all worked out for her and was a smart career move, not only did her vocals work with this kind of music, the public embraced her. The thing that stood out in my mind about this was Olivia wanted to change her direction in music, John Farrar wrote some of his best songs from Physical and Olivia really shines on this album vocally.
Karen also wanted to go in a different direction, I feel that had Karen been in better health condition and she had the support from her family and A&M there is no doubt she could have made it. Of course Karen is not a hard rock singer but you can hear a more mature sounding Karen on her solo album, soft yet sexy in her delivery. She was confident and she was in control about what songs were going to be recorded. I think that shows alot about her as an artist. She was seeing what else she could do and for me I just love how she sounds on her solo album.
richard_sloat
Member
BarryT60 said:
I HATE the characters from Strength of a woman and The uninvited guest... they could have been the same person. I consider them to be passive-agressive (the words Maria Galeazzi used to define Karen), weak, emotionally crippled women. I'd like to SLAP them around.
richard_sloat
Member
song4u said:
I believe the OK Chorale is not featured in this album, they are in Voice of the heart.
richard_sloat
Member
I actually enjoy the "Carpettes", it's the album that is so-so to me, not them.
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