Bill O'Reilly's 'No Spin' Mendes Comment

[LPJim]

Last night I had the car radio on the all-talk FM station (WNOX 100.3). It was broadcasting Bill O'Reilly's radio show, which was returning after a break for news & ads.

The piano intro from"Mais Que Nada" was playing in the background. Bill's first comment was:

"That's from the first Sergio Mendes & Brasil '66 album. The first album was the best." That's all he said before moving on to the next topic.
JB

 

[Mike Blakesley]

Well he must not have heard the 2nd or 3rd which are both better. Of course that's just my opinion, but I think EQUINOX and LOOK AROUND each have several tracks that beat the socks off everything on the first album.

 

[Dave]

Well, like I once said "Mas Que Nada" is to Sergio what "The Lonely Bull" is to Herb... Easily the most-recognizable track, but, yeah, from the subsequent LP's onward, Sergio did outdo what could'a otherwise ended right where it started...


Dave

 

[Trevor]

I think that the first album (Herb Alpert Presents) has a tightness, rawness, and simplicity that the other albums don't have.

"Look Around" has added (nicely) orchestras and sounds more "produced", more "finished".

"Equinox" sounds somewhere inbetween the 2. (of course, because it is), but it doesn't have that rawness that "Herb Alpert Presents" has, and it doesn't sound as finished as "Look Around" does. It's just somewhere inbetween...

Ironically enough, my favorite song from the "Pre-Karen" days is "Constant Rain" from "Equinox".

 

[seashorepiano]

I'd have to say Equinox is my favorite Sergio Mendes album, period. It's in between two other seminal albums of his canon, and has this very tight sound that I think really cements the image I have of "Sergio Mendes & Brasil '66." It's not sophomoric, yet also doesn't have the embellishments of Dick Hazard thumbsup and Dave Gruesome thumbsdown.

 

[Harry]

It appears that older A&M stuff is making the rounds of talk radio. I happened upon a segment of the Glenn Beck show where he was doing some shtick about the immigration issue and using some old TjB tracks for background. It was kind of nice to hear these old tracks on the radio again.

Harry

 

[Aqua do Brasil]

It's not sophomoric, yet also doesn't have the embellishments of Dick Hazard thumbsup and Dave Gruesome thumbsdown.

Mr. Seashorepiano,

A little bit more respect for the great legendary musician, arranger
and fine pianoplayer Dave Grusin is in its place right here.

Dave Grusin made his marks in the record, movie and film industry for more than 4 decades.

Dave played, arranged and produced good recordings for Sergio Mendes. Remember the highlights ‘The look of love’, ‘Pretty World’, ‘You stepped out of a dream’, Crystal Illusions’, ‘So many stars’, ‘ The trouble is to say goodbye’, ‘Morro Velho’, ‘Upa Neguinho’ and many more.

I suppose that the great musicians and singers like Quincy Jones, Lee Ritenour, Ivan Lins, Dori Caymmi,, Caterine Valente, Andy Williams, Earl Klugh, Patty Austin, Tom Browne, Sadao Watenabe, Diana Schuur, Kevin Eubanks, Oscar Castro Neves, Eric Marienthal, the Rippintongs, Dave valetin, Gerry Mulligan, Herb Alpert and many, many more can’t be wrong.

He is highly respected by the above mentioned artists.

And I’am certainly not amused about your words ‘Dave Gruesome’.



All the best,
Aqua do Brasil

 

[Harry]

Some people have their little pet peeves. I think that seashorepiano has expressed displeasure at Mr. Grusin before - others have too. Changing the last name in posts to "Gruesome" is little different than the number of people on the Internet who think it's cool to put a dollar sign in Micro$oft, as a way of signifying their view that the software giant is greedy.

People who have negative views of something or someone tend to give them somewhat disparaging names. But Aqua, in this case, I support your claims that Mr. Grusin is not only not-so-bad, but indeed a wonderful part of the Mendes recording legacy. I've always enjoyed the Dave Grusin touch.

Harry

 

[JMK]

I've always been surprised by the negatives about Grusin, too. I personally think his orchestrations on "Fool on the Hill" (especially) are among some of the greatest of American popular song of the 20th century, let alone Sergio's oeuvre. "Upa, Neguinho" and "Reza" simply couldn't be better, IMHO. I know that some seem to especially dislike his orchestral wrap-up to "What the World Needs Now," but I tell you as a pre-teen getting that album just a few days before Christmas, 1969, it seemed like a perfect holiday greeting for peace on earth at the time, and still does to me every time I play it. There are several other standouts for me throughout his long collaboration with Sergio: "Crystal Illusions," "Moanin'", "Look Who's Mine," etc.

 

[Dave]

Those "extravagant orchestrations" by our "Grusome" Dave Grusin make the "Symphonic Sergio" what it is... I'm sure Mendes likes his work "spiced up" by Mr. Grusin, much like how Wes Montogmery's A&M/CTi work has been embelished by those "strings & things", Orchestrated Ostinados and Swingin', Spiralin' (Mostly Spiralin'...!) Symphonies, courtesy of Producer, Creed Taylor and of course, "Maestro of Monsterous Musical Mayhem", Don Sebesky...

It is nice to have a rudimentary, organic sound, and well, I think explorations beyond the typical boundaries is a cool thing, too!

...That's why we're fortunate on Sergio's behalf, for SOME Musical Ambition! --"No ambition, no Mendes!"


Dave

...just humbly 'n' humorously being "The Devil's Advocate", here, Online...!

 

[Harry]

Well good - I'm not the only Grusin booster.

Harry
...who thinks "Grusinbooster" sounds like a made-up German word, online...

 

[seashorepiano]

And I’am certainly not amused about your words ‘Dave Gruesome’.

I would invite you, Sjef, to look at some other threads around here where the same name is given to him, if not worse. (Also, check out some the lack of sympathy for Don Sebesky!) I'm not the first one to say it (as Harry has said).

Anyway, I'll admit his popularity is wide and reaches all corners of the earth. I respect that. However, I do not particularly care for his arrangements where his strings get in the way of voices or other important* instruments. I think a little respect for that opinion is in place here.

* = not to discredit violins, violas, celli, etc.

 

[Mike Blakesley]

Grusin's arrangements tend to be more "busy" than Dick Hazards, and some feel that the orchestrations tend to stomp on the fine Brasil '66 band and cover up the band's sound to a degree. While I can understand this viewpoint, I have to say that some songs (like "Crystal Illusions") really benefit from the Grusin arrangement.

 

[walterphil]

i'd have to say look around is my favorite. first of all it's the best album cover. (lani never looked more pretty)

but while i love the first two lps almost as well, i don't think there is anything on them that compare to the sublime beauty of "like a lover" or "so many stars." nor is their anything on them as exciting as "roda," or "the frog." (ok. the one exception: "for me")

and even tho i do like many (many!) parts of the next 4 lps, i don't think overall that any of them hit the mark the way that the "look around" lp did)

and i often wonder what album #4 would have been like had he not fired everyone, and started over

 

[seashorepiano]

Agreed, Walter... while Equinox is my favorite album of the three, "So Many Stars" gets repeated around here at least three times, one after the other. Hazard's string arrangements are lush but not distracting. Great song.

 

[Aqua do Brasil]

I would invite you, Sjef, to look at some other threads around here where the same name is given to him, if not worse. (Also, check out some the lack of sympathy for Don Sebesky!) I'm not the first one to say it (as Harry has said).

Anyway, I'll admit his popularity is wide and reaches all corners of the earth. I respect that. However, I do not particularly care for his arrangements where his strings get in the way of voices or other important* instruments. I think a little respect for that opinion is in place here.

* = not to discredit violins, violas, celli, etc.

Hi Mr. Seashorepiano,

thanks for your reaction.

I do respect everyones personal opinion about the collaborators
-arrangers- who worked on Sergio Mendes recordings in the past.

And IMHO not all Grusins arrangments for Mendes’ recordings are favorites of me especially the ‘Beethoven orientated’ treatment at ‘What the world needs now’ is something too much and ‘over the hill’ so to speak.
My favorite version is the original Jacky DeShannon 1965 Burt Bacharach arrangment/production on Imperial/Liberty records.

But aside of his recording skills I had the pleasure to see Dave Grusin performing live at two concerts in the Netherlands; one set with the late Carlos Vega, Lee Ritenour, Phil Perry and Jimmy Johnson and in another set with Tom Scott, Lee Ritenour, drummer Art Rodrigues and one other unknown bandmember.

I enjoyed this versatile pianoplayer very much.

In fact Sergio Mendes has two big hits with Grusin arrangments,
‘The look of love’ which peaked at number 4 (1 week at peak) and
‘The fool on the hill’ which peaked at number 6 (1 week at peak) at the Billboard charts.
And Sergio’s biggest hits ‘Never gonna let you go’ which peaked at number 4 (4 weeks at peak) was a complete Robbie Buchanan affair only with Sergio’s name on it (except for the percussion part by Sergio.)

All the best
Aqua do Brasil

 

[seashorepiano]

And IMHO not all Grusins arrangments for Mendes’ recordings are favorites of me....

Agreed. I'm not saying all Grusin's arrangements are bad. In fact, I'm sure he's helped Sergio and others reach the dizzying heights of the recording industry. Now, who's up for talking about Don Sebesky?

 

[A&Mguyfromwayback]

Wow - I can't imagine the records without those orchestrations, for better or worse. Grusin, to me, is not only a great musician but an impressario - even if 'smooth jazz' is not your thing, think of all the great music the world wouldn't have heard had it not been for GRP

 

[Rudy]

Grusin's arrangements tend to be more "busy" than Dick Hazards, and some feel that the orchestrations tend to stomp on the fine Brasil '66 band and cover up the band's sound to a degree. While I can understand this viewpoint, I have to say that some songs (like "Crystal Illusions") really benefit from the Grusin arrangement.

From a musician's standpoint, I agree: I've sometimes felt that Grusin's arrangements "walked all over" the Mendes sound, where Hazard's were complementary. Then again, maybe that is what Sergio wanted--we do not know! (And yet...I like how the album Sergio Mendes' Favorite Things on Atlantic came out!)

I'm not a big fan of his recordings, but I was a huge fan of the label he and Larry Rosen, created: GRP. I've always felt it had a strong "family" sound, similar to what A&M had. A shame that it was pretty much stripped bare when all the artists were dropped and the back catalog axed wholesale. It was very similar to A&M in ownership too: a musician and a "music industry guy" teamed up, one the "ears", the other the "dollars".

 

[Dave]

Yes, compared to Grusin, Dick Hazard was really, very conserative in his orchestrations, which in addition to 'complementing' Sergio and Brasil '66, also worked in 'behind-the-scenes arranging' for the likes of Barbra Streisand and Andy Williams, as well...

Funny, how Dick's arrangements were never Hap-HAZARD-ous!


Dave

 

[Trevor]

I think Dave Grusin was perfect on "País Tropical". "Gone Forever" had perfect orchestration.

 

[PartyRico]

I'm with SeaShorePiano on this one..."Equinox" rocks! I love EVERY S.M. recording on the A&M label, but Equinox knocked my socks off! Lani has a killer voice, and the band is so tight. The songs are great and varied. On Chove Chuva is that a sitar?

 

[seashorepiano]

On Chove Chuva is that a sitar?

Brasil_Nut (btw, where is he these days?) offered some nice thoughts on Sergio's inclusion of other instruments in an old thread here:

And yet, it all comes down to the 'sound' of Herb Alpert Presents. Aside from Lani's vocals, its simple, yet understated arrangements are awe-inspiring. And so, I wonder what might have happened had Sergio applied this treatment to Equinox and Look Around? What if he had not added a sitar to Chove Chuva? What if For Me had never included the organ? Or, try to imagine The Look Of Love without an orchestra. It's simply amazing how Sergio, with the gradual inclusion of various elements into each project, evolved and grew within his own sound. There are not many artists who have been able to accomplish this goal with such favorable results.

I think it was an imitation sitar, but not the real thing out of the east. JMK might be able to verify this or set the record straight. I don't remember where I read it.

 

[JMK]

No, I'm pretty sure it was a real sitar, but some Google-head may prove me wrong. I remember having a big argument with my high school girlfriend when I insisted that Sergio had used a sitar before the Beatles had. I think that was the beginning of the end of that relationship.

 

[Dave]

Well, we've gone from 'Grusome Grusin Comments' to the sitar on "...Chove, chove, chove Chuvaaaaa..."

I believe it might have been an uncredited Bill Plummer... (A session-Bassist, but in a world of Carol Kaye's and Ray Pohlman's, a Sitar-Specialist...!) As for whether or not it is an authentic (With as many as [YES!] a THOUSAND strings) or perhaps, the Modernized 6-String Danelectro, which was a guitar making that "authentic" sound... (Of which some had as many as TWELVE strings, like a guitar) Some players even SAT down, playing it, as they would "the real thing"...!

Well, it was the first and last time any exotic instrument as that was ever used on a Sergio Mendes recording... (Besides the TROMBONE on "Agua De Beber"...)


Dave