Herb's new EP

[TonyCurrie]

A track from the new EP premiered on Saturday's Tony Currie Show on Radio Six International - the show repeats at 1900UTC (8pm UK, 9pm Europe, 10pm Moscow, 12 noon Los Angeles, 2pm Chicago, 3pm New York) tomorrow, Tuesday 19th July. www.radiosix.com

It's the second record on the show.

 

[Bonnie Johnson]

A track from the new EP premiered on Saturday's Tony Currie Show on Radio Six International - the show repeats at 1900UTC (8pm UK, 9pm Europe, 10pm Moscow, 12 noon Los Angeles, 2pm Chicago, 3pm New York) tomorrow, Tuesday 19th July. www.radiosix.com

It's the second record on the show.

Am I understanding this right? He is putting out an EP like the Beatles Magical Mystery Tour EP that were two records the size of 45's?

 

[Steve Sidoruk]

No, a CD with less tracks than an album.

 

[Bonnie Johnson]

No, a CD with less tracks than an album.

OK, I didn't know there were EP CD's. Why less tracks?

 

[Steve Sidoruk]

Perhaps there is a theme or concept and only a few tunes were included. Hopefully, it would be priced accordingly. Other than that, we'd have to ask Herb.

 

[Bonnie Johnson]

Perhaps there is a theme or concept and only a few tunes were included. Hopefully, it would be priced accordingly. Other than that, we'd have to ask Herb.

Just found out that all an EP is is a double something.

Hopefully, it would be priced accordingly

Wink Wink, Nod Nod, say no more.

 

[Harry]

Just found out that all an EP is is a double something.

The letters stand for "Extended Play" from the days when LP stood for "Long Play". The idea was that an EP would be the size of a 45 RPM and might house four tracks, two on a side.

In the CD era, an EP is just a disc with anything more than two tracks, usually four.

 

[Steve Sidoruk]

Just found out that all an EP is is a double something.

Wink Wink, Nod Nod, say no more.

Well, EP actually means EXTENDED PLAY. It was usually a 45 with two tracks on each side. My experience is that they seemed to be more popular overseas.

 

[Rudy]

And it's more confusing when some artists release CD singles that can have as many as eight tracks--usually seven versions (including remixes) of the same tune, and maybe a second track.

I have EPs on CD that run maybe five or six tracks, or even more--it's usually a mix of total playing time and number of tracks. One BR549 EP I have contains five short tracks (Temporarily Disconnected). Another has six tracks (Bonus Beats, a rare promo-only release with tracks from their 2nd album recorded live in the studio) which times out to about 18 minutes, and another live EP (Live from Robert's) has ten tracks, although four are "dialog" (talking between tunes in the set, which amounts to 66 seconds total between the four of 'em). Most EPs seem to go only 20-25 minutes, tops. Some artists even call a two- or three-song CD an "EP."

 

[Mike Blakesley]

An EP started off as a longer-playing 45, but today it's just an album that's shorter than a real album. Generally four tracks, but could be three to six. In the 80s, Columbia/Epic put out a slew of them on 10-inch records to try to snag buyers at a lower price point...I remember Cheap Trick had one called Found All the Parts that had four songs on a 10-incher.

I'm curious why Herb would put out an EP as opposed to a full album, unless it's meant to help promote the catalog release and he hasn't had time to finish a full album, given the closeness of the catalog release date. Or maybe he's planning a new tour and wants a new product to promote.

Given the catalog release, I thought it would be cool if he put together a new Tijuana Brass and went out and played the old arrangements. They could videotape the shows for a BluRay release. Maybe the TJB stuff could be Part 2 of a two-act show. But we all know Herb doesn't like to live in the past so that's doubtful to happen.

Still, if the intent of the catalog release is to snag new generations of fans....they'd probably wanna see a live show, no?

Heck if he was doing a full-blown TJB show I'd probably fly anywhere in the country to see it.

 

[Rudy]

I have a couple of those Epic 10"ers--one by The Continentals, the other by Shakin' Stevens. IRS Records also put out EPs in both 10" and 12" varieties and I have a handful of those also (Fleshtones, Klark Kent, Patrick D. Martin, Oingo Boingo, etc.). The punk (and new wave) movement often used unusual formats to sell music, or even cover art--the first Police single ("Fallout" b/w "Nothing Achieving") sold partly due to its cover:

"It sold purely on the strength of the cover, because of the fashion at the time. Punk was in and it was one of the first punk records – and there weren't very many to choose from. The average punk had every punk record that was available and when the next one came out which was the Police record, he bought that, too. But still I think it was a good record, so it did more than the average punk single."

— Stewart Copeland, Melody Maker, 9/1979​

The original EPs date back to the early days of 45s, before the long-playing record really became established. RCA would release a 12" LP, but also release an EP or two with four tracks from the album on a 45RPM record, often in a paperboard album sleeve. One thing I have noticed is that the 45 EPs don't sound as good as the equivalent LP, where one exists--they had to reduce the bass so that they could cut more time onto a side of a 45RPM record.

 

[Aaron Bitman]

It's funny. I used to be a cassette man, so I thought of an EP as an album with the same program on both sides.

 

[DeeInKY]

Heck if he was doing a full-blown TJB show I'd probably fly anywhere in the country to see it.

After mid-August I'm free to go anywhere. I just need contributors to the ticket fund.

 

[AM Matt]

An EP is like 4 or 5 or 6 songs!! Matt Clark Sanford, MI

 

[TonyCurrie]

Didn't mean to start such a great debate......but since you ask:
The development of microgroove recordings just after WW2 led to some commercial battles between major record companies. Some opted to produce the microgroove equivalent of the 10 inch two-sider as a 7 inch disc running at 45rpm; others chose 33 and a third. Once things settled down, the format was determined by the limits of what technology could do. A 7 inch could hold around three minutes a side of audio; a 12 inch could hold not more than about 22 minutes a side. And so the single and the LP as we came to love them were born. But engineers quickly discovered that the limiting factor wasn't just the duration. The depth of cut made a difference too. With a bit of experimenting, they were able to get around 7 minutes a side on a single. And in the days when the average song was two and a half minutes, that meant you could comfortably get four songs on one disc. In the US that ability was never much exploited, but in Europe (including the UK) it was used very heavily to bridge the gap between the singles buyers and the album purchasers. If my failing memory can be relied on, a single was 6/8 (six shillings and eight pence), an EP was 13/11 (thirteen shillings and elevenpence) and an LP was 32/6 (thirty two shillings and sixpence, which was in fact £1 plus twelve shillings and sixpence. In other words, quite expensive). So for much less than the price of two singles, you could buy (almost) half an album. EPs sold well and some even got into the singles charts. Many 12 track LPs were also produced as a series of three 4 track EPs creating the enticing possibility of acquiring an album bit by bit as you could afford it. The popularity of the EP began to fade when budget albums came along, for nearly fourteen bob (shillings to you on the other side of the pond) for four tracks didn't compare terribly well with 10/6 (roughly half a £1) for a full size LP, albeit often with ten rather than 12 tracks. With the arrival of CDs, the EP came to be used as a device for issuing small compilations when an artist had either not sufficient new material for a full blown CD; or had a musical idea that only ran to maybe half a dozen tracks. So what has Herb in store at the beginning of September? I've only heard one track so far (the one I'm playing on the radio) but it's very catchy indeed. And I understand there will be a full album as well at some time in the future. Not to mention the reissue of practically the entire catalogue on CD and the classic 60s albums on vinyl a few weeks away. Happy days!

 

[Steve Sidoruk]

HUMAN NATURE has 9 tracks and times out at 30:47.

 

[TonyCurrie]

.....which once upon a time would have been just one track short of an LP!!

 

[Harry]

Herb Alpert Full Albums with 9 tracks or less

BEYOND - 9 tracks, 39 minutes
BULLISH - 8 tracks, 39 minutes
HERB/HUGH - 7 tracks, 34 minutes
MAGIC MAN - 8 tracks, 36 minutes
MAIN EVENT LIVE - 8 tracks, 49 minutes
RISE - 8 tracks, 41 minutes
UNDER A SPANISH MOON - 9 tracks, 34 minutes
WILD ROMANCE - 9 tracks, 40 minutes

 

[Mike Blakesley]

There was a time, just before CD's debut, that 9 tracks was considered a full album. This was exacerbated due to a lot of artists making epic album closers that took up the space of two or three regular-length songs. Almost every artist has at least one track longer than 6 minutes in their '70s repertoire -- even folkies like Dan Fogelberg got on the bandwagon.

I blame "Free Bird" for this trend getting traction, although it's probably "In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida" that really started it.

 

[Steve Sidoruk]

Advance orders on August 5th.

 

[Rudy]

It's not so much the number of tracks as it is the length of the entire release. Gino Vannelli's first A&M album has seven tracks, but only totals about 24 minutes playing time. That would probably qualify as an EP today. Some records I have contain only three tracks, but total over 45 minutes; definitely not an EP. It doesn't really matter what it's called.