⭐ Official Review [Album]: "MADE IN AMERICA" (SP-3723)

[GaryAlan]

Surely, it cannot be ignored that Karen is singing in a higher than usual key throughout much of Made In America....
not, that I mind.....
By the way, I have grown to appreciate the album through the lens of the intervening years.....
On the other side of the coin, I can't understand how the album A Kind of Hush gets so downplayed....

 

[Vinylalbumcovers]

I'll just add that I find it completely perplexing to me that some who "dis" MIA so emphatically praise Karen's solo album so highly. Personally, I thought MIA as one of their Top 5 albums in my book. I actually LOVE "Strength of a Woman" and "Back in My Life Again." I thought the entire feel of the album to be fresh and "California." I was 14 at the time it came out and have only grown to appreciate it over the years/decades. Sure, at 14, "Because We are In Love" and "Somebody's Been Lyin'" were not my favorites, but almost every other song on that LP was fantastic (although "Those Good Ol' Dreams" was one I thought was just "meh."). Compared to Karen's solo album, the quality of the songs, Karen's performances, Richard's arraignments, and the overall production is far superior to the abomination Phil created with Karen...especially the terrible material and Karen singing way above her "basement" range throughout.

Karen's solo record definitely had problems. IMO, the Javors tunes weren't good enough for Karen. Karen needs good lyrics to bite into and neither tune had them. I also don't like the Cetera tune at all. The lyric is incredibly weak and the blend between Karen & Peter is poor at best.

On the whole, though, it's a far better album for me. Phil didn't bury Karen under tons of overproduction the way Richard did on MIA. He didn't use "doubling" either - a practice I don't hate but I didn't like it on MIA at all. Rod was contracted to handle the vocal arrangements along with writing and arranging and, as the kids say, he "understood the assignment." The rest of the record moves through various things and, beyond the Javors tunes, nothing flops for me. It feels like an artist getting with a producer and trying things...and I've always like it...far more than MIA.

Ed

 

[tomswift2002]

MIA was too antiquated when it came out, with only “Back in My Life Again”, Beechwood” and “Touch Me” sounding like modern 80’s tracks, whereas the other tracks were filler and felt like the belonged in the 1940’s, not the 80’s. And “Those Good Old Dreams” was supposed to be reminiscent of “Top of the World”. It was a giant step backward (plus as we’ve seen over the last 40 years, the good tracks that should’ve been released were thrown in the vault behind a locked door that was not suppose to be opened, and MIA featured songs that should’ve been in the vault, or with “I Believe You”, just left as a 45 and placed on a compilation as it was placed on the 1978 “Classics”.)

Also, with “I Believe You”, it had been out for 3 years by 1981, and had only appeared at the bottom of the chart (and aside from Canada, had not charted anywhere else) and had clearly not worked. So they decide to record an album featuring 70% of the same type of music that didn’t work. Clearly they did not learn from three years earlier, except for 3 songs.
Really, the album should’ve been called “Missing In Action.

 

[WYBIMLA]

Well, I don't want to drag this on and on, but I suppose from now until the end of time fans will be having this discussion.

No matter what album it is the artist cannot win or expect that fans are going to receive each song.

This album wasn't Thriller or Eagles best hits.
But that said I am not going to sit and pretend it's unreliable, unprofessional, too slow or boring, etc.
At the end of the day it's part of the Carpenters collection and they were sold as ordinary, average people but they have extraordinary talent and irreplaceable gifts they left for the world.

The piling on from the public and fan groups about this is what A & M execs voiced concern about for any Carpenters release, at that time.

Whether it was a solo album or not---even a 'traditional Carpenters album' was subject to scrutiny.

It's very clear entering the 80s for The C's was no easy feat.

They both recognized, as early as 1977, they wanted a kind of change. That was the circumstance, it was unresolved from their past and they had been in trouble for a while. I feel for both of them and probably more so for Karen because the self-criticism and self-doubt must've been so real for her.

I think both KC and RC solo works have shown similar divisiveness about the final product too. We do the same thing where we point out the best from those albums and ignore music that actually isn't as bad as it's made out to be.
Same goes for how they segued into the 80s with MIA.

Aside from Music, Music, Music it seems the Carpenters in the 80s doesn't get good reviews. I am not so sure why it's harsh like that. You can look at a website like "Rate Your Music" and type in Carpenters and you'll see there is a downward trend in terms of reception.

The safest decision for them was "ok let's just do songs that feel right for us to do." I agree it wasn't necessarily a risk and they stated that's the concept too. It was 'middle of the road' and that approach is actually a prominent feature of Carpenters throughout the years. When needed to venture out to a do variety of material they did, but usually stuck to the sound they developed together. Not sure why fans expect anything more or less from MIA.
In this case, you can't say it was too inconsistent or 'out there.'
But the disadvantage is then they're told "you did that before and so and so already did that before."

So honestly guys... they couldn't win.

This was released back in the era of music where you didn't necessarily have to have every song be a single.
That idea wasn't invented until 1983 when Michael Jackson decided fans deserve quality music all the time. And MJ chased after that for the rest of his life and that's part of what consumed him. Perfectionism is a dangerous road.

I think it's ok that the Carpenters practiced what they preached about doing music more sensibly. After years of giving themselves to the public and their fan base, it wasn't a bad thing for them to do something for themselves.
I have an appreciation for the album, in that sense of it.

It isn't particularly extreme and that's not a bad thing. I'm not sitting there listening to it like it's about me, me, me the entire time either. I am listening to music according to the Carpenters and enjoying it.

And that's the challenge and the good stuff of what music and art can be about too. Over time it grows on you and you just accept it as a Carpenters release, in the context of that time.

Maybe I am having a difficult time articulating this point.

I find over the recent decades, music consumers/listeners take music and artistry for granted. It's more become a culture of shame and humiliation.
For the naysayers and nit pickers on this board you're gonna end up with music produced by Artificial Intelligence and more manufactured songs because you can't seem to stand anything human. That's what you're gonna get. If you don't like the human touch and have a love grown cold, then you'll end up with soulless music. I still enjoy the older songs and don't limit myself. Pop music and good vocals peaked around the 80s.
Might've been great from the 1950s - 1980s and it fizzled out. So I want to hold space to appreciate music from those time periods and what's left of it, if that's cool.

 

[Another Son]

Karen actually isn’t singing very high on some of the tracks where it sounds as if she is. For example, on earlier albums, she demonstrated that she had the range to cope with ‘Touch Me When We’re Dancing’ but, for whatever reason, she sounds as if she’s straining for the higher notes on the recording, causing the listener to assume the song is set high. The same goes for the higher notes of ‘Those Good Old Dreams’, ‘When It’s Gone’ and ‘Strength of a Woman’ - which does actually have a high note on it - the ‘Ah!’ after “To understand the weakness of her man”. All the other notes are well within Karen’s range and she hit them more convincingly on earlier recordings / albums.

Maybe the album was out of step with the new styles and genres coming out in 1981. However, in the US, there was still a huge market for more ‘old fashioned’ middle-of-the-road adult contemporary. This style of music still sold big there right throughout the 80s and onwards. Other markets perhaps weren’t as conservative, overall, as the US but, even in Britain and other territories, this style of music sells massively, even today, as seen by Carpenters’ recent sales there. I therefore don’t think that Richard (and Karen) made as big a blunder with the album as some are saying.

The proof for me, though, is not in how many copies an album sold but in how much I enjoy the record. For me, there is more than enough of what I love about Carpenters for me to hold the album in esteem - Karen’s deep, rich register, Karen’s beautiful higher register in places, the delectable harmonies of Karen and Richard, Richards distinctive and fitting arrangements, his glorious keyboard work, some of his clever and apt choice of songs, his masterly melody composition and his production values.

I’m glad to have ‘Made in America’, just as it is.

 

[Mark-T]

I'm glad we have it as well.

 

[tomswift2002]

Between 1978 and 1981 they should’ve released a few test singles where they were experimenting. Like with Karen’s solo album, A&M should’ve allowed at least 1 45 to be released to test the “waters” in 1980/81. That would’ve given them a sense of direction.

 

[WYBIMLA]

Between 1978 and 1981 they should’ve released a few test singles where they were experimenting. Like with Karen’s solo album, A&M should’ve allowed at least 1 45 to be released to test the “waters” in 1980/81. That would’ve given them a sense of direction.

That's actually not a bad idea. I don't remember hearing this idea about MIA before. I suppose "I believe you" was thought to be along those lines.
It was a test for what the 1979 album was going to be along with the elusive "Thank you for the music" and "Honolulu city lights."
Might've had "Slow Dance" and "You're the one." Not sure if there was any final track listing for the 10th anniversary album.
I suppose we can only speculate about that one.

I guess with the series of interruptions and crisis like treatment, marriage and solo trials, etc. It seemed The Carpenters needed a break by utilizing a song that felt safe for them to put on an album. I think they were shying away from strenuous activity that would mirror the chaos of their touring and recording in the 70s.

I wouldn't be surprised if part of their meetings post-MIA was about using pre-recorded content on their next album.
So, if you were a fly on the wall, I am sure a lot of what was discussed was a combination of new and older material. They were just starting to think more resourcefully.

It appears they both had a desire to look back on some songs they had come across before. Either re-mixed or re-recorded. If you think of it, MIA contains ideas they'd probably thought of or mentioned in meetings before, but couldn't get to it until 1981.
Creative process is actually a lot slower than buying public realizes. It can take years sometimes for an artist to get a song out. It might've been tracked many moons ago, but it isn't until the next album opportunity that they get around to it after their other commitments and general life stuff settles down.
Sometimes abandoning a project all together, but I think when Karen talks about doing things more sensibly for The Carpenters and their band and all involved she meant it.

So by 1983's release (in an alternate reality where Karen survived) it'd likely have had "Now" and probably outtakes from MIA on it too, but the buying public wouldn't have been able to tell if it was a vocal from 1981 or 1982. That's my own theory that they'd start using some of their over recording habits to their advantage in the 80s or keep those recordings close by for anniversary editions after coming so far in their career.

I hope that makes sense.

 

[tomswift2002]

Well Richard was back recording in February/March 1980 when “Music, Music,Music” was in production. Just like A&M released “The Christmas Song” in 1977 to tie into “The Carpenters at Christmas”, A&M should’ve released a 45 of two of the songs from MMM in 1980. Like “You’re Just In Love” and “I’ve Got Rhythm”.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

It’s amazing how chatty this album has got recently.

 

[WYBIMLA]

It’s amazing how chatty this album has got recently.

It's because I wasn't here for a while. Lol


Might be because there's missing aspects and info from the 80s in general as far as the Carpenters story or even Richard's solo work during the decade.
There are some gaps there, so we keep coming back hoping to learn something else about it or find something new. Idk

 

[Cuyler]

Between 1978 and 1981 they should’ve released a few test singles where they were experimenting. Like with Karen’s solo album, A&M should’ve allowed at least 1 45 to be released to test the “waters” in 1980/81. That would’ve given them a sense of direction.

Fully agreed. In the late-1970s/early-1980s, the trajectory of music was changing so drastically. It would have been impossible for the Carpenters to know at the time how to meld their sound with public demand without testing the waters, imho.

Also worth noting that by the late-1970s, A&M artists like The Police, Styx, and Supertramp were on the rise. That being said, if "Touch Me When We're Dancing" would have been released in 1979 or 1980 as a test single, I think they would have found there was a huge demand for Americana/country music (coinciding with the Reagan wave), à la Kenny Rogers, OR kind of late yacht rock (which I think the Carpenters would have excelled at, like "Sailing on the Tide").

 

[WYBIMLA]

I suppose The C's could've also focused on international markets too. Not sure if that was possible at that time or if marketing was thought like that within the music industry at that time.
That seemed to come in a bit later around the 1990s.
So the title of the album is also up for questioning because it seems to be well received elsewhere besides the United States. Lol Ironically.

Music throughout the decades evolved so quickly within America that there isn't a best selling artist who could really keep their fan base and listening audiences engaged. They couldn't stay on the "Top of the world" forever and they knew with the way music kept changing they couldn't keep up.

That's why we have Passage and why Karen was thinking about Disco or doing another eclectic record of her own.

I agree there is some guess work The C's were doing and there didn't seem to be any release valve for that issue. It was also the time period. I don't know that for sure. I'd think over time both the label and the artist would take an act like the C's to venture out into more than just the states.
So, what was perceived as old, tired, out of fashion would be thought of as new in other markets internationally.

 

[A&M Retro]

Hindsight is 20/20 vision, that's for sure. I've vacillated between loving MIA and placing it in the lower rungs as the years have progressed. But it's really a pretty darned good record aside from Karen not being front and center in the mix.

I certainly played the heck out of it in 1981. My first reaction was very positive, though I thought 'Because We Are In Love' and 'Somebody's Been Lyin'' were duds (and still do). And I still don't think it was necessary to include 'I Believe You'.

On the other hand, 'When It's Gone' didn't do much for me in '81, but I love it now! And I LOVED all of the other songs on that album and still do to this day. It just goes to show that perspectives can change. But, overall, I'm very happy and thankful we've got it in 2022.

 

[WYBIMLA]

^ that's only fair to say.

I find the wedding song idea with Carpenters is an occasional thing. You have to be in the mood for it, you know? Lol

I don't always listen to "We've only just begun" in that context, but the song was used for that purpose. "Because we are in love" is very wedding song sound and more for Karen.

It's also Disney-esque. That's Karen and Richard leaning into their love for Disney music score and characters that they like too. The song matches what KC was saying on GMA about the album as well.
How she wanted to get into musical films and things of that nature. "Because we are in love" functions as a wedding song concept, but also might be toying with the idea of film. That's how I think of it.
When you put it together with "Don't cry for me Argentina" (and there are a few other songs) you can hear she was desiring to get into that arena, but I don't think she knew how exactly. KC said she was available for a movie, but I have no idea if any scripts actually made it to her mailbox.

There was conversation about Karen going into the 80s as a featured artist on a film soundtrack. I don't know what film that would have been.
I can almost hear "All because of you" for an indie type drama film. That's after the fact of course.
But, there was something in the making as far as being on a film soundtrack for Karen.

I can tell she wanted it and likely would have had it in the 1980s.

I don't mind Somebody's been lyin' personally. Akiko Kobayashi recorded it too and it's quite nice.

My fav part is when the vocal overdubs come in on The C's version. You almost want there to be more harmony parts added in it, but it works more like a classical piece of music formatted into a more pop/easy listening record. So, it's an interesting one and a very fascinating read by Karen.

I think of Somebody's been lyin' along the lines of a fascinating read like "Boat to Sail." As in Karen is doing her own interpretation and it's not everybody's cup of tea.

Music, Film and Theatre admirers like me love it tho. hehe

I am curious when Somebody's been lyin' was recorded. It's a bit of a strange juxtaposition with Because we are in love. The two pieces are basically the sum of what ended up happening in her marriage. Obviously, unintended, but there was definitely somebody lyin' and it wasn't Karen.

 

[A&M Retro]

^ that's only fair to say.

I find the wedding song idea with Carpenters is an occasional thing. You have to be in the mood for it, you know? Lol

I don't always listen to "We've only just begun" in that context, but the song was used for that purpose. "Because we are in love" is very wedding song sound and more for Karen.

It's also Disney-esque. That's Karen and Richard leaning into their love for Disney music score and characters that they like too. The song matches what KC was saying on GMA about the album as well.
How she wanted to get into musical films and things of that nature. "Because we are in love" functions as a wedding song concept, but also might be toying with the idea of film. That's how I think of it.
When you put it together with "Don't cry for me Argentina" (and there are a few other songs) you can hear she was desiring to get into that arena, but I don't think she knew how exactly. KC said she was available for a movie, but I have no idea if any scripts actually made it to her mailbox.

There was conversation about Karen going into the 80s as a featured artist on a film soundtrack. I don't know what film that would have been.
I can almost hear "All because of you" for an indie type drama film. That's after the fact of course.
But, there was something in the making as far as being on a film soundtrack for Karen.

I can tell she wanted it and likely would have had it in the 1980s.

I don't mind Somebody's been lyin' personally. Akiko Kobayashi recorded it too and it's quite nice.

My fav part is when the vocal overdubs come in on The C's version. You almost want there to be more harmony parts added in it, but it works more like a classical piece of music formatted into a more pop/easy listening record. So, it's an interesting one and a very fascinating read by Karen.

I think of Somebody's been lyin' along the lines of a fascinating read like "Boat to Sail." As in Karen is doing her own interpretation and it's not everybody's cup of tea.

Music, Film and Theatre admirers like me love it tho. hehe

I am curious when Somebody's been lyin' was recorded. It's a bit of a strange juxtaposition with Because we are in love. The two pieces are basically the sum of what ended up happening in her marriage. Obviously, unintended, but there was definitely somebody lyin' and it wasn't Karen.

All good points. I do think the performances are great on those two songs. They were just a little too sleepy for my then 19 year old ears. But I’m glad we have them.

 

[Harry]

Moved a bunch of posts that weren't either related to this album or music in general. They became their own thread idea.

https://forum.amcorner.com/threads/karens-ego.18579/

 

[Richard’s namesake]

I completely agree Byline. As much as my opinion about this isn't a popular one amongst Carpenters fans, I completely agree that Karen's album would probably *not* have been a success. We like the tracks because it's Karen, and whereas there is a ton of artistic and creative license on the part of Phil Ramone, Karen, AND the band, I just don't hear anything that says "YEAH, play me over and over again on the radio". Again, the arrangements are fun and relevant for the time period, Karen's harmonies are incredibly superb, and a few of the songs are catchy. Are they HITS?! Probably not. And I completely agree with Richard's comments about Karen's vocal range in terms of sweet spot and marketability - Her lower register is what we are all most fond of and remember of Karen. The solo album featured very little of this. Did she still sound like she knew what she was doing?! ABSOLUTELY. But none of the points that I mention mean that you have a hit album.

I really agree with you Chris. I think that the tracks Richard chose in ‘89 for “Lovelines” are superb. Apart from “Still Crazy” however the album doesn’t showcase her properly. Although I’m so glad I have the album - simply, as you say, because it’s Karen.

 

[GaryAlan]

This is interesting. In the UK....Bubbling Under--August 10, 1981---
#129 Beechwood 4-5789 Carpenters (Magazine: Record Business, page 7).
Page 14, you find out that Beechwood 4-5789 was garnering a fair share of UK-radio programming (#42 and rising).
Page 17, you discover that after 7 weeks on the charts the album Made In America has fallen from #35 (week 6) to #56.
That is a big drop in only one week.

Source:

https://worldradiohistory.com/UK/Record-Business-UK/1981/Record-Business-1981-08-10.pdf

 

[GaryAlan]

So, let us return to September 6, 1980, one report of Karen's wedding.
Garnering more evidence--if any evidence is needed-- of how Carpenters were written about at the time, 1980:
UK Record Mirror:
"THE MOSTEST in camp has to have been the Karen Carpenter wedding."
"After which (with my great belief in nice old fashioned romance) I found that my tongue had stuck to the roof of my mouth In horror at the tales of the proceedings that I gleaned from various sources. There were 450 guests including the Bee Gees parents (!) Olivia Newton John, Nelson Riddle, and various others. Karen also availed herself of no less than 30 bridesmaids - enough to make Emily Nugent turn over in her grave or enough to carry a giant redwood
instead of a train behind the bride. The hotel where the wedding was held was done up to look like Americans imagine English gardens look like."
"Which, If they'd seen mine, they'd have quickly ripped up. Karen was dressed in something resembling English hunting gear. "
" But wait folks, it gets worse much worse ! Short of having the guests sing the Indian love call al each other, it couldn't have got any more over the top.
"The bride then sang Because We're In Love at the groom, an industrialist called Tom (who at this point was probably wanting to get back to the factory as quickly as possible). The groom also holds a hallowed place on Ronald Reagan's finance committee. "
"Then Karen's brother Richard got up and sang the Lord's Prayer and a medley of Carpenters hits. God, can you believe any of this ? "
" It could only have happened In LA, she says generously. Luckily, there was a 50 piece vocal band humming in the background in case the congregation couldn't keep up with this musical extravaganza which makes Oklahoma look like a barn dance."

Source:

https://worldradiohistory.com/hd2/IDX-UK/Music/Archive-Record-Mirror-IDX/IDX/80s/Record-Mirror-1980-09-06-IDX-3.pdf#search=%22karen%20carpenter%22

 

[Harry]

Made In America has fallen from #35 (week 6) to #56.
That is a big drop in only one week.

That's the way it was back in the early 80s. Any Carpenters play on the radio was almost dictated by their song, "Touch Me When We're Dancing", that charted, but radio programmers just couldn't wait to see a weakness on the chart as an excuse to drop the song entirely. And that of course caused Carpenters to no longer be top of mind, and the album plummeted quickly.

 

[GaryAlan]

Cashbox Magazine, November 21, 1981 Feature Picks (page 17).
CARPENTERS (A&M 2386) Those Good Old Dreams (4:12) (R. Carpenter, J. Bettis) (Producer: R. Carpenter) :
"Skipping high hat and light, bright acoustic guitar picking in front of a pop symphonic string ensemble gives this latest offering
from the Made In America LP that unmistakably sugary Carpenters sound."

Cashbox, June 20,1981 Feature Picks:
MADE IN AMERICA - Carpenters - A&M SP -3723 - Producer: Richard Carpenter.
"America's favorite brother and sister team of a few years back is in fine fettle after a long hiatus from the studio. Don't expect a massive directional change from the Close To You days, though. Richard Carpenter's production is clean and modern, but the duo's strength remains its sprite, floating harmonies and A/C pop stylings. Karen and Richard's material here should fare well with adult contemporary and pop programmers considering the current American fervor for middle of the road acts."

 

[Jarred]

"America's favorite brother and sister team of a few years back is in fine fettle after a long hiatus from the studio. Don't expect a massive directional change from the Close To You days, though. Richard Carpenter's production is clean and modern, but the duo's strength remains its sprite, floating harmonies and A/C pop stylings. Karen and Richard's material here should fare well with adult contemporary and pop programmers considering the current American fervor for middle of the road acts."

This is an interesting review because it’s positive, or trying to positive, yet it also confuses a bit. It says there isn’t a big change from the CTY days of 1970 but then calls it “modern”; I can’t imagine anyone would call their brand of old-fashioned styled (but still contemporary) pop of the early 70s as representative of 1981 (but, most fascinatingly, it’s that 70s era of there’s which sounds more timeless than most from the 80s in 2022). The MIA sound is aping those bread ‘n butter years but, as most would agree today, is a weak facsimile of it. There’s glimmers of the 80s but it doesn’t majorly shape the sound. There can be wild differences in time span for the concept of modernity for broader social culture and then when it applies to (pop music) trends, and in these earlier era’s of music the idea of a sound being modern was much more mercurial then it later became starting in the 2010’s, let’s say.

And then the review states the album should do well because there was an American taste for MOR/AC acts, which from what I’ve heard-tell about was true in the early 80s, but as know failed to happen. The writer could’ve been a fan or overly optimistic but it didn’t gel with flavor people wanted. Could it have been just the image issue where stations weren’t taking that risk or that the soft sound wasn’t 80s enough, both beyond the quality of the material? It’s interesting that there were fans in publications of the time who imply that they thought MIA had a real shot.

 

[Vinylalbumcovers]

This is an interesting review because it’s positive, or trying to positive, yet it also confuses a bit. It says there isn’t a big change from the CTY days of 1970 but then calls it “modern”; I can’t imagine anyone would call their brand of old-fashioned styled (but still contemporary) pop of the early 70s as representative of 1981. The MIA sound is aping those bread ‘n butter years but, as most would agree today, is a weak facsimile of it. There’s glimmers of the 80s but it doesn’t majorly shape the sound. There can be wild differences in time span for the concept of modernity for broader social culture and then when it applies to (pop music) trends, and in these earlier era’s of music the idea of a sound being modern was much more mercurial then it later became starting in the 2010’s, let’s say.

And then the review states the album should do well because there was an American taste for MOR/AC acts, which from what I’ve heard-tell about was true in the early 80s, but as know failed to happen. The writer could’ve been a fan or overly optimistic but it didn’t gel with flavor people wanted. Could it have been just the image issue where stations weren’t taking that risk or that the soft sound wasn’t 80s enough, both beyond the quality of the material? It’s interesting that there were fans in publications of the time who imply that they thought MIA had a real shot.

Couldn't agree more. One could call "MIA" a lot of things but "modern" isn't one of them. The one time they try for "modern" ("Want You Back..."), it fails because Richard won't stop orchestrating. The vocal arrangements are enjoyable (when aren't they?), but he cloaks them in elevator music that really only tries to be modern rather than succeeding at it. The rest is just standard Carpenter arranging devices applied to lesser songs.

Ed

 

[Jarred]

Couldn't agree more. One could call "MIA" a lot of things but "modern" isn't one of them. The one time they try for "modern" ("Want You Back..."), it fails because Richard won't stop orchestrating. The vocal arrangements are enjoyable (when aren't they?), but he cloaks them in elevator music that really only tries to be modern rather than succeeding at it. The rest is just standard Carpenter arranging devices applied to lesser songs.

Ed

He even knows how much he can’t help himself from (over) orchestrating; the new book quotes him as saying “everything with me turns into a production”, in regards to “Argentina”, which is at least more fitting for it and wasn’t even fully arranged by him. Want You Back is trying so hard to be hip and trendy but can’t let go of the classical, un-trendy core roots of its arranger and singer. The material, as often noted, is the real culprit here. The album would be far better remembered today if there was more substance to what we heard even if just wasn’t going to fly in 1981. But then you think about what they have done going ahead if Karen lived and still recorded with him.

The 80s would’ve continued to be very rough for them as a duo, commercially. It’s like, if he placed Karen in the framework of the sound he used on Time we would be cringing today hearing this timeless, ethereal voice competing with dated drum machines and synths, but then if he stuck with the Carpenter formula heard here then the albums would be on record store shelves collecting dust. But as heard from a song like Kiss Me the way You Did Last Night, there was a possibility they could’ve found a fresh sound of the era while still capturing the timeless core.