Flat Baroque 45

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

I recently picked up a collection of 45's & was listening to them tonight for the first time.

Does anyone have this song on 45? It's on the mustard/gold color A & M label it's #1351. Time on the label is 1:48.

I compared this 45 of Flat Baroque to the same song on A Song for You Lp. The 45 seems like a slightly slower version. The Lp version says it is 1:45. That is not much difference in time but the 45 still sounds slightly slower to me.

Can anyone do a side by side on their 45 & the Lp version of this song & tell me if they hear the exact same recording or anything different.

Thanks

 

[W.B.]

It may boil down to a difference in how the time was calculated between when the LP was assembled and when the single was issued. I listened to "Flat Baroque" on both the 45 (my copy has the "shiny ochre" label - PMS 125C - used on some Columbia-pressed A&M singles made around the spring of 1972) and the LP A Song For You, and found the sequence of the song to be exactly the same; in short, the very same recording. Moreover, I don't seem to detect much difference in pitch between the LP and 45 versions. I suppose if I were to count the total revolutions spun from beginning to end, there may be some slight difference here and there, but on the average, one has to have a very trained ear to discern them.

But then, on the LP, "Flat Baroque" led in to the sung-by-Richard "Piano Picker," though there was no cross-fade between numbers. On the 45, it stood alone.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Thanks William,

If anyone has the 45 pressing #1351 that I mentioned above & can give it a comparo I would appreciate it. I swear it still sounds a tab slower on the 45. Enought for me that it makes the song sound quite different.

 

[Rudy]

Does your turntable have a strobe and speed adjustment on it?

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Yeah mine has a red strobe light.

I ask about this 45 cause, there have been some Carpenters 45's that have been known to be speed up or slowed down. Perhaps Harry can confirm this with me. I know that the "I need to be in Love Mono 45 I have is speed up just a tad & there are others too.

Remember these are just minor so unless you have a trained ear you really won't tell.

 

[Rudy]

I'd probably notice it if I heard it. I'm speed sensitive.

 

[W.B.]

This may be of some help. I checked the exact times of the song from the two sources side by side, and this is what I came up with:

On the lacquer marked "A+M 2301S-P2" of the 45 (AM-1351-S), "Flat Baroque" timed in at 1:48. On the lacquer marked "A+M SP3532-P2" of the LP, the same number timed in at 1:46. And there was no blank space in between that and "Piano Picker." So either the 45 was decreased in pitch, or the song on the LP was increased in pitch, by somewhat less than 2 percent (give or take a few decimal points). Nonetheless, the timers for the LP underestimated the song's length by all of one second.

 

[Harry]

Here's my take, now that I'm home to check things out. I dug out the single, AM 1351-S, "Flat Baroque" (the b-side to "It's Going To Take Some Time", lacquer number A&M 2301 S-P1, and compared it to the Remastered Classic CD of A Song For You, 828239 3511-2 and detected next to no difference speedwise. I could hear a slight change in the locations of some of the instrumentations, left and right of the stereo, but it sounded pretty much the same to me speedwise.

Then I dug out the old LP of A Song For You (SP-3511), the original issue with flap, side two lacquer number A&M SP 3532-P1 and compared it with the CD mentioned above. There's a definite speed difference here, both on "Piano Picker" and "Flat Baroque."

I suspect that the original album pressing may have been running too fast, and in remastering, Richard brough it down to the correct speed. We'll need Rudy's ears to tell us which is correct, the original LP speed or the Remastered CD speed.

Harry
...checking out what's in those many grooves of his, online...

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Thanks Harry, I knew I wasn't hearing things.

That is the exact LP I was comparing the 45 of Flat Baroqe to....the old LP of A Song For You (SP-3511) the original issue with flap.

This song on 45 sounds more "natural" sounding to me than the LP. But I would be interested in knowing which is the correct version.

 

[Rudy]

I suspect that the original album pressing may have been running too fast, and in remastering, Richard brough it down to the correct speed. We'll need Rudy's ears to tell us which is correct, the original LP speed or the Remastered CD speed.

I think I have the old, original Song For You we owned somewhere around here...likely was an original pressing, or close to it...but I'm sure the years haven't been kind to it. I'm not sure if it's here or across town (I think it's still at Dad's), but I can check once I get them. I don't have the single however.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Rudy, When your ready, I could email you a copy of "Flat Baroque" on 45 if that would help any. My 45 has some slight surface noise in a few second spots but still very listenable.