One station in our market use to fade the song early. Here's the way the fade would have sounded:
Goodbye To Love (early fade) - Clyp »
Harry
Goodbye To Love (early fade) - Clyp »
Harry
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"Goodbye To Love" single review
- Thread starter ScottyB
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How'd that station do in the ratings? Especially against the station that didn't fade?
Here's the simple case for not fading "Goodbye To Love", which I explained to my jocks at the time: Carpenters fans will notice the edit/fade and not be pleased. Non-Carpenters fans will hear it as just another Carpenters record. The guitar solo is the justification for playing the record in the first place on a Top 40 station in the summer of '72, with FM album rock stations (at least out west) eating away at our audience day by day.
Here's the simple case for not fading "Goodbye To Love", which I explained to my jocks at the time: Carpenters fans will notice the edit/fade and not be pleased. Non-Carpenters fans will hear it as just another Carpenters record. The guitar solo is the justification for playing the record in the first place on a Top 40 station in the summer of '72, with FM album rock stations (at least out west) eating away at our audience day by day.
Actually, the station that faded beat the station that didn't fade, and went on to be the flagship of the Greater Media MAGIC℠ chain (WMGK) lasting well into the '90s with that identity (and my eventual employer for 30-odd years). Their early existence was based on never shocking the listener with anything harsh. They played a lot of really soft stuff, folky stuff, album tracks that fit the format from pop artists. By 1981, they got a little more adventurous in their music selection and had gotten rid of Carpenters and Bread entirely.
The station that didn't fade went through a series of format changes shortly thereafter, Top 40, Progressive Rock, Oldies, and back to Top 40 (WFIL-FM -> WIOQ).
Harry
The station that didn't fade went through a series of format changes shortly thereafter, Top 40, Progressive Rock, Oldies, and back to Top 40 (WFIL-FM -> WIOQ).
Harry
Harry: In 1972, wouldn't WFIL-AM have been the bigger station? I only have Arbitron numbers going back to 1975, but it doesn't appear that 'FIL-FM or the WPEN combo (which didn't become WMGK until Labor Day 1975) were anything to write home about, while 'FIL was still in the 8s.
I was talking about WFIL-FM, not AM. In 1971, it was sold by Triangle Publications to a new local company called Richer Communications which was headed by John Richer, who had worked at the station in its Triangle days. He and some investors I believe purchased the station when Annenberg had to divest.
WFIL-AM was the monster sister station on AM that dominated the market at that time. They were Famous 56, Boss Radio, and was THE station in town. On any given summer evening in that era, you could ride around town with the windows open and be listening to WFIL - even if your radio wasn't on. It was much like the scenes depicted in AMERICAN GRAFFITI. The AM station for sure would have played the whole "Goodbye To Love", but now that I think more about it, in 1972, WFIL-FM had changed over to WIOQ and gone really soft with their "Stereo Island" moniker. If they played "Goodbye To Love" it would have been an early-fade version. I suspect they actually didn't play it at all.
WMGK didn't go live until the fall of '75 - early September. By then "Goodbye To Love" was in the recurrent or oldie category. And I'm sure I heard an early fade version. WMGK became what WFIL-FM had once been, and was a pretty big station on the FM band (which was still emerging) for a few years and then shot up in the early '80s with their more pop sound. The '70s WMGK was the one that played a lot of Gordon Lightfoot, John Denver, Ian and Sylvia, Judy Collins, Joni Mitchell, America, Bread, and Carpenters. Very soft.
By 1975, WIOQ was pretty well into their progressive rock phase.
My radio career started at WIOQ, and in 1976 I moved over to WMGK.
WFIL-AM was the monster sister station on AM that dominated the market at that time. They were Famous 56, Boss Radio, and was THE station in town. On any given summer evening in that era, you could ride around town with the windows open and be listening to WFIL - even if your radio wasn't on. It was much like the scenes depicted in AMERICAN GRAFFITI. The AM station for sure would have played the whole "Goodbye To Love", but now that I think more about it, in 1972, WFIL-FM had changed over to WIOQ and gone really soft with their "Stereo Island" moniker. If they played "Goodbye To Love" it would have been an early-fade version. I suspect they actually didn't play it at all.
WMGK didn't go live until the fall of '75 - early September. By then "Goodbye To Love" was in the recurrent or oldie category. And I'm sure I heard an early fade version. WMGK became what WFIL-FM had once been, and was a pretty big station on the FM band (which was still emerging) for a few years and then shot up in the early '80s with their more pop sound. The '70s WMGK was the one that played a lot of Gordon Lightfoot, John Denver, Ian and Sylvia, Judy Collins, Joni Mitchell, America, Bread, and Carpenters. Very soft.
By 1975, WIOQ was pretty well into their progressive rock phase.
My radio career started at WIOQ, and in 1976 I moved over to WMGK.
Harry: You were in a great radio town at a great time! To me, what happens to a song in recurrent or single rotation is not nearly as important as how it's played originally. Any Top 40 station that faded out or edited "Goodbye To Love" was making a mistake....and, I think any AM adult contemporary (of the KFMB, San Diego, WGAR, Cleveland or WTAE, Pittsburgh variety) that played it needed to play the whole thing as well. Old-line MORs that were sticking one cautious toe into the waters of contemporary hits (KSFO, San Francisco, KMPC, Los Angeles, WNEW, New York) probably should have simply passed on playing it....although I believe KMPC did air it (but then, they beat KHJ on Marvin Gaye's "Trouble Man", so they weren't typical.
By the time we got to soft rock FMs, it was far enough down the road from "Goodbye" that I probably would have chosen to not play it at all rather than risk the image of a station that edited songs.
Totally agree - it was indeed a mistake to edit songs - at least at the radio station level. I'm OK with record-company edits.
I recall the first number of times I ever heard "Kodachrome" by Paul Simon. The station I listened to - probably that WFIL-FM/WIOQ station - edited the opening line to "When I think back on all the girls I knew in high school." They sliced that line from the second verse and inserted it in the first. So I just thought that was the way the song was supposed to be. It was quite a shock when I finally heard the correct version! Imagine a station being sensitive about the word "crap" now!
I recall the first number of times I ever heard "Kodachrome" by Paul Simon. The station I listened to - probably that WFIL-FM/WIOQ station - edited the opening line to "When I think back on all the girls I knew in high school." They sliced that line from the second verse and inserted it in the first. So I just thought that was the way the song was supposed to be. It was quite a shock when I finally heard the correct version! Imagine a station being sensitive about the word "crap" now!
I know. KHJ in Los Angeles did the same edit. 270 miles away, in tiny and conservative Bishop, California, I played the Columbia promo single, which used "crap", and didn't get a single complaint call.
I differ a bit on station edits versus record company edits. The record companies could be as brutal and ham-fisted as the worst local jock (think Deodato's "Also Sprach Zarathustra", The Moody Blues' "Nights In White Satin" or The Who's "Won't Get Fooled Again", whereas there were some artists working at radio stations, especially Ron Hummel and Dave Sholin at KFRC in San Francisco, whose edits of The Eagles' "Life In The Fast Lane" (to dispense with "Goddamn"), Stevie Wonder's "Isn't She Lovely" (to remove the crying baby and splashing water) and George Benson's "On Broadway" (which was smoother, cleaner and a bit longer than the Warner Brothers single) were revelations.
Overall, though, my belief is edits are bad. They aren't what the artist had in mind. Some songs, like "On Broadway", at 10-minutes plus, might simply be too long for Top 40 airplay (we're playing Wayback Machine here---this stuff was all 40 years ago and is long gone now), but then, they didn't edit down "Funeral For A Friend/Love Lies Bleeding" or "Kashmir", so it's all about which artist's vision you want to respect.
Hideaway21
New Member
This is one of my favourite Carpenters singles, despite not being in their usual style. I love the video where Tony P is cranking up the guitar and Cubby OB is thrashing the drums in a hard power rock ballad that would become famous in the 80s. It was a departure from their trademark sound, but also not too distant to unrecognizable as a Carpenters track. It hit the top 10 in the US and UK and deservedly so.
CraigGA
Well-Known Member
I remember the radio station I listened to editing the end out as well. My favorite part of the song is toward the end at the bridge: "what lies in the future is a mystery to us all, no one can predict the wheel of fortune as it falls, there may come a time...but for now...Goodbye to Love. And I like the guitar solo leading up to this bridge. My only desire was the guitar solo at the end to add more vocal overdub presence in the mix. I enjoy the song, and my friends of rock liked it more, but I like other hits of the Carpenters better: even It's Going To Take Some Time. But watching it in the live medley on the Tonight Show makes it come alive as a favorite!
ScottyB
Well-Known Member
Ouch! Taking away the end guitar solo really removes a great part of the soul of the entire song.
ScottyB
Well-Known Member
There was a radio station in Connecticut that would edit the crap out of Billy Joel's "Only The Good Die Young". It was pretty much a Catholic-oriented station, and the lyrics to the song did not sit well with the programmers. But, because the song was popular and was being requested, the radio station took it upon themselves (at least I assumed they did) to edit the arrangement of the lyrics to the song to appease the masses. If I recall, it was a horrible, with the new arrangement making little sense at all.
Harry S. Anchan
Well-Known Member
One of my most favorite Carpenter songs, EVER! I just love that sax solo. I have so many but this one is ranks up there. Thank you, Richard!
Harry
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