THE BRASS ARE COMIN'-A Concept Album?

[alpertfan]

Recently there was a post on this forum about a copy of the TJB's BEAT OF THE BRASS on E-Bay. I haven't listened to the old, scratchy vinyl in ages, but I seem to recall that the songs had a Country-Western feel to them, rather than the mariachi/jazz feel of the group's earlier albums, plus the cover displays a picture of the group in cowboy outfits. Would these facts make BOTB a true concept album? What constitutes a concept album, anyway? Does it have to be about a certain subject (everything from the title and the songs, such as in WHIPPED CREAM & OTHER DELIGHTS) or can the feel of the music play a part as well? WHIPPED CREAM is mentioned as the Tijuana Brass's only concept album, but given these facts about BEAT OF THE BRASS, I beg to differ.
What's your opinion.

 

[Michael Hagerty]

Alpertfan:
It's "The Brass Are Comin'" that you're thinking of..."Beat Of The Brass" (3 LPs and one year earlier) features Herb and the Brass in tuxes standing in a field of flowers.
The theme of the "Brass Are Comin'" album hinges on a CBS TV special of the same name...much (if not all...I'm operating on the memory of having seen it exactly once 34 years ago) shot on a Hollywood backlot western town set. To play off that, the music tended toward a western feel ("The Brass Are Comin'", "I'm An Old Cowhand"), though there are exceptions ("Moon River", "You Are My Life").
Does that make it a concept album or a semi-soundtrack (if I recall, not all the songs on the LP were in the special, and there were some songs on TV that didn't make the album) of a concept TV program?
Heck if I know, pardner.

---Michael Hagerty

 

[jimac51]

The song "The Brass Are Comin'" is really a pop treatment of a piece written by Brazilian classical composer Heitor Villa-Lobos. The fourth movement of "Bachianas Brasileras #2",originally wriiten for cello and piano,it is also known as "The Little Train of the Caipira" as featured earlier on the first Paul Winter Consort album(SP 4170),and appears as the subtitle of TBAC on the album cover. Mac

 

[venturaguy49]

Alpertfan had mentioned one cool album, which to some may be too ambitious, but in my opinion, that's the reason for it's appeal. The arrangements were clearly beyond what the 'Brass' had used thusfar, or perhaps it would be more accurate to say that they simply expounded on what had been previously attempted, and succeeded in creating an album that took the basic Tijuana Brass style into another realm. It's such a shame that this fine album has never recieved the praise that it's due, but the fact is that 'Brass are Comin' is on helluvan interesting endeavor. No, it's not accessable in the way that 'Brass' albums had normally been, and I suppose that was the reason that it failed to achieve critical acclaim (typicall, a T.J.B. album 'took' easily, but with Brass are Comin', one had to listen a few times, and get used to it's elaborate qualities, but how many times would it be neccessary to get swept into the gorgeous mood on
"Good Morning, Mr. Sunshine", or that's how I recall the title of the lovely waltz that follows the opening track. Also, as someone that's also very much a Beatles fan, the inclusion of a considerably slowed version of "I'll Be Back" really hits the spot; here one can savor John lennon's fine melody...and elsewhere on this album that has a c.d. equivalent somewhere (both this album and "S.R.O." have been issued in Japan, so maybe "Almo Sounds" may aquire the licence, and issue these gems themselves....hint hint, Herb, if yer reading this
Also, on B.A.C. are some more 'typical' T.J.B. fare: "Moments", "Robber and Cops", and "Anna" provide a more conventional Brass feel, and all is topped by what I personally consider to be one of Alpert's finest ever vocal treats: the lovely "You Are My Life". Here we have the perfect closer to what I regard as being one satisfying album, but again, it required a few listenings to really get into the groove with this one, but it's worth the extra time spent, as B.A.C. is not only an elaborate productions, by Alpert/T.J.B. standards, but it's also a rewarding experience for anyone that bothers to give it a fair chance. Now if it seems that I enjoy this record, well I sure as heck to. Now I'm gonna mosey on out of here, and wish y'all the best.

Warm Wishes,
Steve, who now rides Ole Paint off into the sunset
(but will return sometime...lol cuz I pigged-out of lotza good ole Western
grub, and pardner, because of those beans and an ocean of hookah, I'z been sent away, 'till I'm once again 'sociable' that is!

 

[Michael Hagerty]

"You Are My Life" was issued as a single, but didn't get much airplay, at least in Los Angeles....even on the normally A&M-happy middle-of-the-road stations like KMPC and KFI....which I remember playing "Moon River" as nearly a novelty for a couple of weeks and then abandoning "The Brass Are Comin'" altogether.

Also: Was listening to the LP the other day. Is it possible that "You Are My Life" was originally meant to be for Brasil '66? Dave Grusin produced(his only other contribution to "The Brass Are Comin'" was "Moon River"), and if you listen strictly to the instrumental track, it sounds like it could have been recorded with the same musicians in the same "Crystal Illusions" session as "Pretty World".

---Michael Hagerty

 

[W.B.]

"You Are My Life" was issued as a single, but didn't get much airplay, at least in Los Angeles....even on the normally A&M-happy middle-of-the-road stations like KMPC and KFI....

I happen to have a copy of this 45. Unlike Mr. Alpert's other vocal turns in which only he was listed as the artist on the label, they credit the group and, just below the title, in parentheses is the line "(Vocal by Herb Alpert)".

This was right around the point wherein, viz Columbia's pressings of A&M product, each of the three pressing plants would supply its own label copy artwork. Naturally, my copy is from Pitman, NJ, thus Pitman's typesetting graces the label. . . .

Is it possible that "You Are My Life" was originally meant to be for Brasil '66? Dave Grusin produced(his only other contribution to "The Brass Are Comin'" was "Moon River"), and if you listen strictly to the instrumental track, it sounds like it could have been recorded with the same musicians in the same "Crystal Illusions" session as "Pretty World".

From what I saw on the label, Mr. Grusin didn't actually produce the track -- Messrs. Alpert and Moss handled that end -- but rather was listed as arranger. Still, you may be on to something there about the similarities in sound.

Also . . . were there other compositions by Peter Sarstedt that were as noted as "You Are My Life"?

 

[Michael Hagerty]

The only other song of his that gained any airplay that I'm aware of was his own 1967 hit "Where Do You Go To (My Lovely)".

---Michael Hagerty

 

[Mike Blakesley]

"You Are My Life" by Sergio Mendes & Brasil '66?

I never thought of that possibility, but it could have worked as a Sergio vocal. The arrangement would have fit.

But that arrangement is why it didn't get much airplay...Herb should have asked Bacharach for some input....compared to "This Guy's In Love with You," that YAML arrangement sounds like a tired record from the 1940s. Herb's voice just sounds too small in that huge orchestra setting.

I don't know what it is about "This Guy" that Herb's voice sounds perfect in that arrangement....I have a feeling it's Bacharach's production/arranging touch that does it, because Herb never recaptured that "feel" in any of his other vocals, IMHO. "To Wait for Love" was a valiant effort, but it just wasn't there.

 

[alpertfan]

Thanks, Michael. I did mean, THE BRASS ARE COMIN'. My mistake!

 

[Rudy]

But that arrangement is why it didn't get much airplay...Herb should have asked Bacharach for some input....compared to "This Guy's In Love with You," that YAML arrangement sounds like a tired record from the 1940s. Herb's voice just sounds too small in that huge orchestra setting.

I don't know what it is about "This Guy" that Herb's voice sounds perfect in that arrangement....I have a feeling it's Bacharach's production/arranging touch that does it, because Herb never recaptured that "feel" in any of his other vocals, IMHO. "To Wait for Love" was a valiant effort, but it just wasn't there.

"To Wait For Love" is a slightly quirky song...Tony Orlando had little success with it himself, and the arrangement was very similar. I've heard another arrangement (quite different) by one of Bacharach's regular female singers (it could have been Jackie DeShannon--I'd have to dig out the LP, wherever it is), and it actually works a little better. Alpert's is paced almost identically to Orlando's version, where the backing is a little more recessed in the Alpert version.

But you know that one of my personal "hot buttons" is Grusin's leaden, bombastic arrangements. In terms of Brasil '66, I have figured out why I find Dick Hazzard's arrangements so much better than Grusin's, to where I can now explain it. Take a song such as "Like A Lover" and compare to something like "You Stepped Out Of A Dream". Hazzard had a way with arranging in which his strings and other accompaniment were played at a very low or very high pitch when they were accompanying a vocal. Vocals are all pretty much midrange...that's why Lani Hall is clear as a bell in "Like A Lover". The strings are just there as sweetening. Now compare it to "Dream". Grusin's arrangement walks all over the vocalists--countermelodies and other overly busy flourishes are competing with and clashing with the vocals that SHOULD be in the foreground. Now, in a completely instrumental setting, it works; the final moment of "Pretty World" is proof of that, since the melody is carried out by trumpets or flugelhorns (played in a vocal range). But if there are vocals, there is too much clutter behind them.

This same thing happens in "You Are My Life", to detriment. Alpert has a softer, more relaxed voice, and the arrangement is just TOO MUCH in the foreground and walking all over his singing. A good vocal accompaniment arrangement should complement the singer, not compete for the listener's attention. That song may have worked better with a more sympathetic arranger.

 

[DAN BOLTON]

I don't really think YAML is all THAT bad...yes, it may seem a little cluttered, and there IS a lot going on behind Herb with all those flourishes and such, but the overall sound is bright, and it seems a little airy, somehow...And, you gotta remember that this particular style was really popular at the time this record was released. The song is dated, no question about that...but it is a nice example of the Grusin Sound[I know Neil is cringing...]. I think Herb is a little timid...he doesn't really enunciate "remember" and "September" very well, and he sounds out of breath when he sings "late August"...so maybe he was a little off his game...those words might have been difficult for him to sing...some are easier than others, and maybe the vocal track was "buried" a bit to make those minor clams a little less noticeable.


This song clearly wasn't one of the easiest for Herb to do, but he must have loved it, because he put a lot of effort into it. And, it is a lovely melody...it fits on the album very well as far as style goes...it is a little in the '40's vein, but I love to listen to it. I really cringe at the thought of Sergio trying to sing it though...some people shouldn't even sing in the shower.....

Dan

 

[Michael Hagerty]

Turns out my wife has the Sarstedt original(!)...very similar in sound to the Alpert version...arrangement's identical, if a touch more restrained. After playing them back to back, I really think that this was a backing track Grusin did with the orchestra that Herb added vocal and trumpet to...and in my mind I can hear either Sergio or Lani on vocal with Sergio's piano added in its place...I'll just betcha this came from the "Crystal Illusions" session.

---Michael Hagerty

 

[Brasil_Nut]

I'm really late in responding to this thread, but "The Brass Are Coming" would be the closest thing to a concept album in my book. Then again, look at "Whipped Cream" -- all of the songs are related to food. I would think, to a lesser degree, that "The Lonely Bull" and "Volume 2" would also fall somewhat into the "concept" category. I mean, they represented the theme of the TJB with Latin-oriented songs such as "Marching Through Madrid" and "The Lonely Bull" (to name a few). Again, this is a stretch, but it's somewhat within the realm of a concept album all the same.

Jon

...getting conceptual, online...

 

[Captain Bacardi]

I'm really late in responding to this thread, but "The Brass Are Coming" would be the closest thing to a concept album in my book.

I would agree to a point, since I've always felt this album as a whole was rather tired sounding. The thrill was gone and it sounded like it.


Capt. Bacardi

 

[Rudy]

It has some good moments on it, but on the other hand, it sounds very polished, which may give one the feeling of the TJB "going through the motions". IMHO, Beat Of The Brass sounds more tired than this one. I do like both of these albums, but I usually find myself skating around the tracks on both of them, where other albums I'll listen to all the way through.

 

[Captain Bacardi]

I've always felt that Herb's trumpet sound started going downhill at the Sounds Like... and 9th era, and just bottomed out with Brass Are Comin'. And that's not necessarily a knock on Herb. After all, he was putting out a couple of albums a year, doing relentless touring, producing other acts and trying to keep A&M afloat during those first few years. That would take a lot out of anybody. It's little wonder that he "retired" when he did.

I also only listen to a couple of cuts regularly on the last couple of albums - usually on my own compilations. Good thing the rhythm section was still tight.


Capt. Bacardi
...enduring the first 100-degree day online...

 

[Rudy]

That's certainly the truth--whoever was on the albums' rhythm sections still had it down, oiled like clockwork. A shame that the band was getting better, while Herb seemingly had so much going on, with his own issues to work out. To my ears, he really didn't "nail it" on the trumpet until he did the Herb/Hugh album--that one just blasts out of the gate with some good playing from both of the horns. Not that something like Coney wasn't bad, but in retrospect it felt like he was really back with Herb/Hugh. And that sort of snowballed into "Rise" which took on a life of its own...

 

[Michael Hagerty]

Hey, who can blame them? "Beat of the Brass" goes huge...spawns the label's first number one single, the Christmas Album does well, and then the LP where they decide to trade on that momentum and try something new, "Warm", is a disappointment on the sales charts. Had to be dispiriting...and remember the compressed time frame here...all this happens in less than 18 months.

Not to mention the internal turmoil at A&M. As I've written in other posts, 1969 was a bad year...highest-ranking single was Sonny Charles & Checkmates, Ltd's "Black Pearl", which peaked at #13. Sergio, like Herb, was coming off a great '68 (the "Fool On The Hill" LP and several hit singles) into a disappointing '69 LP and single from a sales perspective ("Crystal Illusions"/"Pretty World"). Jerry was pushing hard to move the label's focus to rock and roll (a move that paid off in '70, '71 and beyond)...and who knows at what point Herb decided his heart was with Lani and not his first wife?

That's a lot of stress for a 34 year old guy who was a struggling unknown 7 years before...who had gone from recording in a garage to owning Charlie Chaplin's movie lot...who knew enough about show biz to see the cycle of modest success from '62-'64, off-the-charts stardom from '65-'68 to darn near nothing in '69 and had to wonder if the ride was over.

---Michael Hagerty

 

[Captain Bacardi]

To my ears, he really didn't "nail it" on the trumpet until he did the Herb/Hugh album--that one just blasts out of the gate with some good playing from both of the horns. Not that something like Coney wasn't bad, but in retrospect it felt like he was really back with Herb/Hugh. And that sort of snowballed into "Rise" which took on a life of its own...

Yup, although for me the Main Event - Live album showed a more exuberant Herb. The tone was back on the studio album, but he seemed to flow a little better on the live album. Masekela seemed to be the perfect sparring partner for Herb at the time, and Herb seemed to be more alive because of it. Those two albums also received some critical acclaim as well, and maybe that rejuvented Herb for his later recordings.


Capt. Bacardi

 

[Captaindave]

Yeah, I agree with all these comments - the trumpet sound from South of the Border, Whipped Cream, Going Places, What Now My Love, SRO, etc, changed in later albums. I've posted on what I consider the more "technical" aspect of this other times...I'll still contend that Herb was "burned out" and I think he may have even said so publicly somewhere back in those times...

Trumpet players sometimes refer to their lips being "shot" - meaning worn out - the inability to produce a clear and resonant tone, and the lack of lip sensitivity and flexibility needed to play well. The usual cure is to put the horn away and rest for a while. Playing the horn is a struggle when this condition is present, and an experienced player can tell...you are "fighting" the instrument because the physical attributes that are involved in trumpet playing aren't functioning as they should...lip isn't vibrating as it should, lack of flexibility, - it's similar to overuse injuries in athletics.

From Beat of the Brass, I like Slick and Panama. Mostly for the overall sound and style more than just the trumpet itself. This Guy's In Love...is, to me, the TJB "swan song," so to speak...IMO, it was all down hill from there...

I'm not really excited about the most of the trumpet I hear on Coney Island - I especially do not like trumpets that are "buried" in layers of electronics and studio effects - this is what I don't care for about Rise... too much "borrowing" from disco recording techiques. BUT, I do like what Herb sounds like on Fandango. Now there is a full, centered, resonant tone. It seems like on that one he has returned to his "roots," so to speak, and is playing like his old self again...

 

[Harry]

I changed the title of this thread to better reflect what the topic-starter, alpertfan, was trying to convey.

Personally, I'll go with the thought that The Brass Are Comin', though it had several 'western' themed songs, wasn't really a concept album, but more of a soundtrack to that particular TV show. Enough's been written on the musical aspect of the album, but one thing I really enjoyed was the artwork. The 'aged' brownish monochrome photo on the cover looking like it was lifted from an old newspaper clipping, the contrasting color photo on the rear cover, and the inside gatefold with pictures from the show, sitting in the wagon -- great stuff. And who among us didn't read through that fine-print list of names looking for those that we could recognize?

Harry
NP: "Anna" from The Brass Are Comin'

 

[Mr Bill]

...And who among us didn't read through that fine-print list of names looking for those that we could recognize?

My neighbor across the street was a stuntman (mainly in westerns) and I found his name (Glen Cook) in there...

--Mr Bill

 

[Brasil_Nut]

...And who among us didn't read through that fine-print list of names looking for those that we could recognize?

It's been so long since I've seen the album cover (like everything else, my copy of The Brass Are Coming is in storage). However, I'm quite guilty of being one who "read through that fine-print list of names," and can't remember...is Sergio in there? How about Lani? Wouldn't this have been about the time they fell in love?

Jon

 

[DAN BOLTON]

Sergio and Lani?


Dan

 

[Brasil_Nut]

Sergio and Lani?

I thought about the way I'd worded that! I mean, are Sergio and Lani Hall on the list, as his would have been about the time Herb and Lani fell in love.

Jon

...giving clarification, online...