Was A&M good or bad for the TJB?

[Steven J. Gross]

I wonder if the fact that Herb Alpert owned A&M Records made A&M promotion folk have to bend over backwards to roster artists in proof that A&M was not just for Herb's interests? I notice that some artists went all out on album layouts, while Herb's album art was low key. Could the TJB have been even bigger on another label?

 

[Harry]

You have to remember that A&M Records was a fledging little company during the great bulk of the TJB's popularity. Lonely Bull through Sounds Like, eight albums, all happened in the first 25 albums released by the label, fully 1/3 of its output. So if those covers were simplistic, then it's understandable -- the company was still very young. I'm actually still quite fond of most of those covers (and they look great on my calendar!).

Around the time of Ninth, a cover that often gets higher praises, things were improving rapidly in the artwork department. That was approximately when the CTi division was cranking out those exquisite Pete Turner photo'd albums, and even the next TJB, Beat Of The Brass, came out as a nice gatefold with that memorable photo of the group in the field of gold.

As for A&M being good for the TJB? Of course it was. The TJB virtually was A&M for quite a bit of those early years.

Harry
NP: SOUNDS LIKE, Herb Alpert & The TJB

 

[jimac51]

Yeah,this is kind of a "chicken and egg" argument. No TJB-no A&M. Like Harry says,the first couple of dozen releases were TJB saturated as any indi label would be with the artist/star as owner. As things got more successful,they pumped money back into the label-signing a more diversified level of artists,enlarging catalog,improving distribution(a hidden backbone of this business that means more as I investigate this wonderful 'ol business of music-this is where Mr. Moss performed his talents as well as Mr. Alpert did in the studio). Improving graphics was a result of all this success.To see how other labels would have handled the TJB,look at how the TJBWannabees fared as they filled the bins. Whether drug store budget labels(Premier,Wyncote),mid level indis(World Pacific,Dunhill,Command) or Columbia,Capitol and RCA(who all tried)nobody knew how to mine the gold like Mssrs. Alpert,Moss & Co. Mac

 

[Rudy]

What if Herb had stayed at RCA, and not formed A&M? Would he have been given the red carpet treatment afforded other giants (no pun intended) like Shorty Rogers, Mancini, Esquivel, etc.? Or would marketing have told him that his type of music had a snowball's chance in Tijuana of selling? Very possibly the latter! He was free to do what he wanted on his own label, and it's fortunate that millions of the record buying public liked what they heard and came along for the ride.

It's interesting to think that if Whipped Cream had never happened, A&M may not have survived as anything other than a niche label. Could they have held on, financially, until Carpenters brought their massive wave of success? With limited success, would artists like Burt Bacharach, Joe Cocker, Cat Stevens, and others before and after them, have signed with A&M if they weren't as big? Probably not. (I'm not including Carpenters, as their history had A&M taking the big chance on them, not vice versa.) Would CTi ever have existed as an A&M venture if they didn't have the success of the TJB albums?

A lot of interesting "what if" scenarios can be made!

 

[Captaindave]

In a 1986 issue of WINDPLAYER magazine, Herb Alpert is asked why he started A&M. His reply was that "it started with THE LONELY BULL." He said that he and Jerry(Moss) "wanted to see how long they could hang on to it." So, they formed A&M for "ownership of the record." He said that the idea behind A&M was "to make every record, all 12 tunes, count. We didn't want the customer to end up buying just the hit and have 11 throwaway songs as a bonus. We wanted to give people their money's worth."(Quotations- WINDPLAYER Interview,Jan/Feb/1986).

So, I think that A&M "is" Herb Alpert/Jerry Moss, and that the creation of the TJB and the LONELY BULL served to launch A&M as an enterprise. It seems to me that the success of A&M is largely synonymous with the creation and success of the Tijuana Brass. The popularity of those recordings and style of music allowed the label to grow and prosper and sign other musicians.

I would speculate that if history were different and there had been no TJB, Herb Alpert, or LONELY BULL, perhaps there would be no A&M either. It sounds to me like A&M was created to deal with the business necessities involved with having a hit recording, and provided the subsequent platform for further recordings and eventually additional artists. The Alpert/Moss partnership was able to become their own company, instead of being the product of one of the other major record companies.

I think that the TJB were the foundation of the label throughout the sixties, along with the assistance of Baja Marimba, Sergio Mendes/Brasil 66, Chris Montez, Claudine Longet, etc.

I think the matter is more that the TJB was good - even necessary - for A&M to exist, rather than the other way around.