TJB - Interesting Picture
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CherryStreet
Member
What do you mean Steve is wrong?!!! You can clearly see that the writing is reversed in the first image and then corrected when Steve posted it the correct way. Hell even the "KODAK" is reversed & wrong in the first image! It still amazes me how many people still doubt/question Steve Sidoruk around here. It boggles the mind.
The pictures appears to be from the UCLA Archive.
You can clearly see it written with a lot number.
You can also make out a date which looks like "68".
I'm going with 1968.
The pictures appears to be from the UCLA Archive.
You can clearly see it written with a lot number.
You can also make out a date which looks like "68".
I'm going with 1968.
mexicat
Member
The first image is correct, even if the border around the picture isn't.
How can we tell?
Easy!
Nick Ceroli, genius drummer though he was, always played right-handed. Watch any clip of him playing and he always plays a drum kit set up for a right-handed player. I don't doubt he could have sat at a kit set up for a lefty and still play in his usual amazing way, BUT...
...The guitarist in the pic is playing a Fender XII electric 12-string guitar, they were manufactured between from late 1965 to 1969. Fender may have made left-handed versions of this particular model, but they're extremely few and far between. One thing they never made were left-handed guitar amplifiers (which is what you can see in the 2nd pic). Look really closely at the little 'blackface' Fender amp (so-called because up until 1968 the control panel was black with white detailing, in later '68 Fender changed the black panel to a silver one...) in the first pic: the guitar cable plugs in EXACTLY where it should, i.e., top left of the control panel. The model name of the amp is visible at the top right of the control panel where it should be. Check any Fender site or book for a lefty blackface amp, you'll be looking for ages...
Obviously the print information surrounding the 1st pic is reversed, but then magazines and website designers often add a border from a contact sheet for visual effect, could be the case here. And I don't know where the original poster got the pic from, but the image is definitely the correct way 'round... I'll bet my burrito on it!
How can we tell?
Easy!
Nick Ceroli, genius drummer though he was, always played right-handed. Watch any clip of him playing and he always plays a drum kit set up for a right-handed player. I don't doubt he could have sat at a kit set up for a lefty and still play in his usual amazing way, BUT...
...The guitarist in the pic is playing a Fender XII electric 12-string guitar, they were manufactured between from late 1965 to 1969. Fender may have made left-handed versions of this particular model, but they're extremely few and far between. One thing they never made were left-handed guitar amplifiers (which is what you can see in the 2nd pic). Look really closely at the little 'blackface' Fender amp (so-called because up until 1968 the control panel was black with white detailing, in later '68 Fender changed the black panel to a silver one...) in the first pic: the guitar cable plugs in EXACTLY where it should, i.e., top left of the control panel. The model name of the amp is visible at the top right of the control panel where it should be. Check any Fender site or book for a lefty blackface amp, you'll be looking for ages...
Obviously the print information surrounding the 1st pic is reversed, but then magazines and website designers often add a border from a contact sheet for visual effect, could be the case here. And I don't know where the original poster got the pic from, but the image is definitely the correct way 'round... I'll bet my burrito on it!
I hate to disagree with Steve, but looking at the evidence, I have to side with Mexicat that the OP picture is the correct way around.
In addition to the left-right drum guitar thing, if you blow the picture up, it's just barely visible, but Tonni Kalsh's arm shows what looks like a wrist watch. Most men wear watches on their left arm. I realize this isn't concrete proof, but it's another clue.
Harry
In addition to the left-right drum guitar thing, if you blow the picture up, it's just barely visible, but Tonni Kalsh's arm shows what looks like a wrist watch. Most men wear watches on their left arm. I realize this isn't concrete proof, but it's another clue.
Harry
I wonder if this was taken at the Musicians Union rehearsal rooms on Vine St. in Hollywood, as this is what the rooms used to look like and everyone used to rehearse there....I think the original was the correct image, but trumpet players, where are you? Can't they look at how Herb is playing and figure it out.....
By the way, it could have been a real rehearsal - trust me, a trumpet player in that size room that close to the other players doesn't need a mic....!
By the way, it could have been a real rehearsal - trust me, a trumpet player in that size room that close to the other players doesn't need a mic....!
CherryStreet
Member
Mike Blakesley said:
Mexicat? It was audiofile who first pointed it out. And I apologize and bow down!
They look like film tins, Perhaps Bob was using them as they rehearsed his cymbal routine as they ran through the running order? I still say the pic is 1968.
Either way looking forward to seeing Herb, Lani and their amazing band as they premier & film the debut of their new CD Thursday night facing the "right" way from the Vibrato stage to a sold out crowd!
Captain Bacardi
Well-Known Member
That "Kodak" printing could be on the negative, and that would often print in reverse. It depends if the "Kodak" was printed on the front or rear of the film.
If the print from the negative is uncropped, this likely came from a medium format camera with a square aspect ratio (6x6, which is Hasselblad and a couple of others), so it likely came from 120 roll film. If that's the case, a print from the negative could blow up to near poster size and look really good.
Anyway...
Check out Herb and Tonni--they are both playing the valves with left hands. It's hard to see on Herb's trumpet, but clearer on Tonni's. John Pisano is also a right-handed guitarist.
This is actually like detective work!
Sorry 'bout the hubcaps, Cap'n. Didn't know you drove a '67 Plymouth Fury.
If the print from the negative is uncropped, this likely came from a medium format camera with a square aspect ratio (6x6, which is Hasselblad and a couple of others), so it likely came from 120 roll film. If that's the case, a print from the negative could blow up to near poster size and look really good.
Anyway...
Check out Herb and Tonni--they are both playing the valves with left hands. It's hard to see on Herb's trumpet, but clearer on Tonni's. John Pisano is also a right-handed guitarist.
This is actually like detective work!
Sorry 'bout the hubcaps, Cap'n. Didn't know you drove a '67 Plymouth Fury.
As a serious photographer of more than 40 years, my comment was made based on the original photo/negative being backwards. You'll note that my proof sheets below, correctly show the negative numbers, film brand and product (Kodak Tri X). That's how they are supposed to look. Proof sheets are made when the negatives are placed on a sheet of photo paper, covered by glass to hold them flat and exposed to light under an enlarger.
That some of you "eagle-eyes" found the content to suggest otherwise is great, however, the negative is still backwards. The question would then be, how & why? There are several possibilities. In the days before Photoshop, everything was manual and mechanical. Editors would take liberties with photos sometimes by reversing a photo so that a person is not "looking" off a page. This could also be a copy negative that had been turned backwards in the process.
In the meantime, please enjoy some of my photos of the '74 TJB from the Warwick Musical Theatre in Warwick, Rhode Island.
That some of you "eagle-eyes" found the content to suggest otherwise is great, however, the negative is still backwards. The question would then be, how & why? There are several possibilities. In the days before Photoshop, everything was manual and mechanical. Editors would take liberties with photos sometimes by reversing a photo so that a person is not "looking" off a page. This could also be a copy negative that had been turned backwards in the process.
In the meantime, please enjoy some of my photos of the '74 TJB from the Warwick Musical Theatre in Warwick, Rhode Island.
The hairstyles look a little conservative for 1968. The date (assuming that's what it is) is written in the same hand as "UCLA", which means it was done after the fact and isn't an absolute timestamp.
Herb and the guys were sporting some serious sideburns by '67, so I'll guess this is '66 or earlier.
---Michael Hagerty
Herb and the guys were sporting some serious sideburns by '67, so I'll guess this is '66 or earlier.
---Michael Hagerty
Steve Sidoruk said:
I've seen that happen as well...it's only folks like us who notice pics like those are backward.
Whatever the source of your print, I would guess it was used in that orientation in whatever publication printed it. I have also seen a handful of prints over the years, correctly oriented but with the negative identification printed backward.There are occasionally inter-negatives printed as well. This is usually done with slide film to make a print on normal photographic paper (as a slide is a "positive" not a "negative" image).
IOW, there are any number of ways a photo could have been flipped like this...and based on what Steve reminded me of, editors often do flip images to make them more suitable to a publication. There is even an A&M/CTi album cover images that was "flipped" in this manner to make it more suitable for the Antupit album cover design. Anyone care to guess?
Wave was flopped (and as everyone knows, took on a blue/green tint, which Pete Turner says he has come to accept).
But so was Road Song. I have four Turner prints here in my office, Wave and Road Song among them. Sitting here looking at the fence on the right, as opposed to the album cover.
But so was Road Song. I have four Turner prints here in my office, Wave and Road Song among them. Sitting here looking at the fence on the right, as opposed to the album cover.
[email protected] said:
I was 12 when I bought Road Song new....and wondered where they put up white picket fences as center dividers...
Picket fence was outside the Kansas City Airport. He shot another photo at the same spot. http://www.peteturner.com/Misc2/images/06.jpg
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