📣 News Carpenters: "The Vinyl Collection"

[Rudy]

Just one other thing as I hate to be so negative...

Me as well! My main thing about all this fuss is that I would rather not see forum members/fellow fans get stung by something that is obviously suffering in quality control. For many, buying this entire box set is a stretch. Anyone buying this set, or the individual records, deserves their money's worth!

 

[Vinylalbumcovers]

2001 was when the last original album was released! And even then Richard was using tapes that were over 30 years old! Also we know that some of the 2-track masters have deteriorated because of other issues (I.e. Christmas Portrait). However, it seems that Richard still has access to a number of the multi-tracks(I.e. “Christmas Memories”, ‘Christmas Alphabet’, ‘Make Me Laugh’). Even if they are no longer in analog, a first digital generation copy (one copy away from the original analog recording)would essentially be the same as the original analog recording. It would be like if I shot something on S-VHS, digitized it to a computer for editing and then played it back out to S-VHS. My last version would be the same quality as my first, unlike if I just went from S-VHS to S-VHS, and I lost a generation.

The 2001 release isn't part of this package so there's no need to discuss it, really. The last album in the package, again, was produced in 1989 which was indeed decades ago.

Tape can be pretty robust but age is what it is. Oxide can go over time and the quality can diminish. I work with ¼ inch/ ½ track all the time so I've seen/heard it for myself. Play a tape over and over again over many years and you're asking for it. That's just how it is. It's almost a guarantee that those tapes sounded better during the first vinyl run than they do now - even though I doubt whatever's left sounds awful now.

Ed

 

[theninjarabbit]

Agreed. We have no idea if they were manufactured in different countries for global markets.

Could be a "Beatles vinyl box" situation. UK/EU vinyl was virtually flawless. (I own one--it's as good as they say, and then some! Clean, flat, quiet, completely ideal in terms of the manufacturing quality.) Rainbo, on the other hand, pressed the US version, and those had all sorts of issues. I only purchased Rubber Soul and Revolver and both had defects. "Eleanor Rigby" had a deep scratch more than halfway through the track. On one track from Rubber Soul, it skips. Those weren't the only issues, but they were two of the most notable. I haven't had records skip since I was a kid! (And back then taping a quarter to the tonearm was usually the cure for that! )

Yeesh. Now I'm slightly worried about the Sgt. Pepper picture disc I'm getting for the holidays.

 

[Cuppadan]

It's a shame we have to talk about how bad this is instead of discussing the great sonics and imaging of what could have been.

 

[Song4uman]

I'm going to clean mine again in the next few days and look even more closely at the vinyl and give each a listen. I know that one of them had a weird scratch/smudge looking thing, but the sound was fine. I'll report anything I notice...
Jonathan

 

[Carpe diem]

It's a shame we have to talk about how bad this is instead of discussing the great sonics and imaging of what could have been.

I completely agree. This should've been an enjoyable event for Carpenters fans. Another building block on the duo's wonderful musical legacy.

 

[Jonr]

Agreed. We have no idea if they were manufactured in different countries for global markets.

Could be a "Beatles vinyl box" situation. UK/EU vinyl was virtually flawless. (I own one--it's as good as they say, and then some! Clean, flat, quiet, completely ideal in terms of the manufacturing quality.) Rainbo, on the other hand, pressed the US version, and those had all sorts of issues. I only purchased Rubber Soul and Revolver and both had defects. "Eleanor Rigby" had a deep scratch more than halfway through the track. On one track from Rubber Soul, it skips. Those weren't the only issues, but they were two of the most notable. I haven't had records skip since I was a kid! (And back then taping a quarter to the tonearm was usually the cure for that! )

I was never ,ever able to get a clean copy of Abby Road and I recently even tried again. All were terribly pressed. Someone mentioned above there will be a UK pressing...I will most definitely give that a try...thanks for bringing that to our attention.

 

[Jonr]

Yeesh. Now I'm slightly worried about the Sgt. Pepper picture disc I'm getting for the holidays.

My experience is you don't buy picture discs if you really want a good quiet pressing. Has that issue changed? I haven't purchased one in years. I know I'm passing on the new Taylor Swift because they are initially only coming out as picture discs at $50!

 

[Jonr]

Since you guys are the Carpenters experts, what IS considered the best pressing of Horizon? I've owned many and a couple I have are real nice but the best mastered one I own is a bit noisy.

 

[jaredjohnfisher]

Hello everyone! I'm a big Hoffman Forum contributor and have been lurking around here for a few years but this is my first post. I wish it were for a better reason. I love the Carpenters, and a lot of the reason is I really appreciate Richard's very, very hard work with his production. I used to own a recording studio and know how much work what he did is. I am not minimizing Karen's work in the least. It's just that her contributions as a vocalist are very obvious, notable and realized by anyone that appreciates her style of vocals. Production is something most people, frankly, are not really aware of. And sound quality, unfortunately, is also something we know most folks don't really care about, or are educated in. I have always had an appreciation for the overall sound quality of the Carpenter's productions. It makes me really happy whenever I hear about how much Richard, still, cares about that aspect of his work.

So, regarding their new vinyl albums, frankly it makes me very angry. I understand Richard communicates with one or more of you, and that he will likely hear of our comments. There are pressing plants that are putting out consistent, high quality vinly pressings. And there are a couple that put out consistently very poor quality pressings. I will go out on a limb and state that the labels are very aware of this, and I also have no doubt it's all about cost. Albums by mainstream artists that may sell 50,000 copies (Taylor Swift) at a price of $20 for two discs are usually pressed at low quality. It takes me 3-4 returns before I get a copy of her material that is even close to acceptable (for all four albums I have of her). I don't think this is a coincidence or my bad luck. But, I realize this demographic probably doesn't care that much about pressing quality. But in general, reissues that are $30 plus, and audiophile recordings, are typically well pressed and sound fantastic for the most part, in my experience. I have what I think most here would think is a higher end vinyl rig, and for better or worse it is very transparent. My VPI Prime table is very revealing. So, when I get a pressing that is poor, I always ask myself why a label would purposely want to degraid their artist's music? Especially an artist or group as iconic and the Carpenters, especially when many in this demo DO care about quality, as Richard does.

So, I have purchased at least 15 copies of Horizon over the years, alwasy trying to get the very best copy. It is in my top five of all time favorite albums, and I just love it. The rare album where every track, imo, is very well done. I know the recording well. I just received my reissue. It's a mess...I won't even go into it it's so screwed up. It exhibits pretty much all the defects mentioned above by others. But the worse thing to me, and the reason it's going back without me even bothering to exchange it, is the mastering. It is veiled, and clearly a few generations away from my best other pressings. Just sad. But it's been many years since it was recorded and perhaps this is simply as good as we're going to get. But the defects in the vinyl are inexcuseable for a group like this. If I were Richard, I would be furious as there is no way anyone will convince be that UMG didn't know ahead of time that product coming from wherever they pressed it (Rainbo would be very suspect imo) would be exactly as it is. It seems like it's an accident if you get a good pressing from them. I would have far preferred to be charged significantly more for a quality pressing. I also received a copy of Now & Then. The pressing is so bad I gave up pretty fast and I don't have an opinion on the mastering as I didn't get that far. I was disgusted and it's simply going back. And that is the end of my excitement or desire to experience this rerelease. I'm glad I didn't spring for the box, and that I've held onto all my other pressings.

To their label I say, shame on you for doing this on purpose to such an iconic group led by someone that would care about this issue. I wish I could hear him on the phone when he expresses his feelings about how their material was handled so irresponsibly. I do congratuate those that got a good pressing, and are enjoying them. I wish I could count myself in your court. I look forward to contibuting in the future, though I hope it's on a more positive note. Thank you to everyone that has contributed interesting comments in the past that I have enjoyed!

I certainly concur with your assessment of the situation. After reading your post, it occurred to me; perhaps the overall “less than” quality of the box set will not be a major setback to the “new” record buying public for which it is aimed. Sadly, standards have been lowered. Those used to listening to compressed CDs may think these records sound incredible! Also, I would bet the average record buyer (of today OR yesteryear) never even thinks to clean a record before playing it! Most people I’ve talked to (about my record collecting hobby) comment about how they (sometimes fondly) remember the “snaps, crackles, pops and skips”; something my well-cared for records rarely did. (I’m the one who purchased the box set mainly for the clean artwork; I already have several nearly-perfect playing original Carpenters LPs.)

 

[GaryAlan]

UM Marketing:

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

I'm not having very good luck, I just opened ASFY and it's filled with marks and scuffs, another hole defect plastic has caused a small tear to the label (see white dot it's the tear of the ochre color which I am not happy. These pics were taken right after opening the new LP. Can it get any worse, yes...the complete outer rim of the LP is so rough it almost will cut you and not only that there is a raised knot of plastic on the outer rim however it kinda close to when the stylus could come in contact with and that scares me since I've paid so much for this stylus.

I cleaned the LP just to see if these marks would come off and no dice, they are still there. At this point, it doesn't matter how it plays because the LP is just a mess and I will be adding this to the other one in asking for a replacement. I'm starting to lose hope and I am about to open the next Lp next. Some of these pics I tried to get the label to show I'm not making this stuff up. I am a true die hard Carpenters fan that just wants a good product for my money.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Raised Knot

 

[Harry]

That's just plain ugly.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

That's just plain ugly.

Yes and the way I'm feeling right now is that this plant needs to be shut down. lol Sorry I need a laugh or I'll cry.

 

[newvillefan]

Can it get any worse, yes...the complete outer rim of the LP is so rough it almost will cut you.

Wow. Just wow. I dread to think what Richard will make of all this. What a shame.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

I just opened Now & Then...the artwork is brilliant, just beautiful gatefold love love love it. Here is the bad news, another defect in hole punch with more plastic on the hole sticking up but worse is the label has major damage, it feels like huge dent running your finger across this like the LP wasn't fully complete in the molding process or how ever it's done. It's got the same scuff marks and scratches. My list of replacements keeps getting longer and I'm quite upset. I'm afraid to open the next album. I mean guys would you keep this stuff? It's making my old 70's A&M Lp's look like gold.

 

[CARPENTERS-COLLECTOR]

I'm not having very good luck, I just opened ASFY and it's filled with marks and scuffs, another hole defect plastic has caused a small tear to the label (see white dot it's the tear of the ochre color which I am not happy. These pics were taken right after opening the new LP. Can it get any worse, yes...the complete outer rim of the LP is so rou

I cleaned the LP just to see if these marks would come off and no dice, they are still there. At this point, it doesn't matter how it plays because the LP is just a mess and I will be adding this to the other one in asking for a replacement. I'm starting to lose hope and I am about to open the next Lp next. Some of these pics I tried to get the label to show I'm not making this stuff up. I am a true die hard Carpenters fan that just wants a good product for my money.

Wow. Just wow. I dread to think what Richard will make of all this. What a shame.

reading these posts is making whether to buy this new set or not easier each time ........... and what a shame!
I`m not sure where the quality control is in these album releases, but someone needs to get a grip of it, because it`s not only this box-set suffering, it`s also the `collected` vinyl.
I`ve had to request a refund or replacement for my copy, because it`s terrible and I can`t listen to it.
I notice on a couple of posts, that there`s a possibility as to whether or not Richard is aware of all these issues, because if he isn't, he should be! there`s no excuse in this modern era for such poor quality, I`m not technical on how vinyl is produced nowadays compared to 40-50 years ago and I suspect not much has changed, but for vinyls to come out in the condition shown above, is disgraceful really.

 

[Carpe diem]

I just opened Now & Then...the artwork is brilliant, just beautiful gatefold love love love it. Here is the bad news, another defect in hole punch with more plastic on the hole sticking up but worse is the label has major damage, it feels like huge dent running your finger across this like the LP wasn't fully complete in the molding process or how ever it's done. It's got the same scuff marks and scratches. My list of replacements keeps getting longer and I'm quite upset. I'm afraid to open the next album. I mean guys would you keep this stuff? It's making my old 70's A&M Lp's look like gold.
No Rick, you should not have to settle for this. I didn't buy the set but I feel outraged for the shoddy product that is being presented to people who spent their hard-earned money on this. Send it back, you deserve better! And No, that is not normal manufacturing processes around the label hole...OUTRAGEOUS!!

 

[newvillefan]

I`m not sure where the quality control is in these album releases, but someone needs to get a grip of it, because it`s not only this box-set suffering, it`s also the `collected` vinyl’

By the look of things quality control has been pretty much non existent.

 

[ars nova]

The 2001 release isn't part of this package so there's no need to discuss it, really. The last album in the package, again, was produced in 1989 which was indeed decades ago.

Tape can be pretty robust but age is what it is. Oxide can go over time and the quality can diminish. I work with ¼ inch/ ½ track all the time so I've seen/heard it for myself. Play a tape over and over again over many years and you're asking for it. That's just how it is. It's almost a guarantee that those tapes sounded better during the first vinyl run than they do now - even though I doubt whatever's left sounds awful now.

Ed

i'm lost what was the 2001 release?

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

I'm pretty much done uploading further photos, it's just too time consuming. I've opened the rest of the LP's, AKOH is filled with scuffs and scratches and the label has a tear near the hole punch on both sides. MIA has a major flashing hole, so much plastic that I can't even get it on my record doctor cleaning machine spindle, also tried and it won't even go down on my turntable spindle either. The label also has a small tear near hole. Just a mess. I took pics but won't upload. Also you should have seen all the plastic, shreds of it coming off the side of one of the LP's and some of my inner rice paper sleeves are folded and crumbled like the person jammed it inside the LP jacket.

The others The Singles, Horizon, Passage, VOTH and Lovelines "visually" look ok, good labels and holes but some scuffs, I don't have time tonight to clean them like they need to be as they are very dirty. I will try to do this on the weekend. I've got to talk to the retailer about my next move soon. I almost want to get a full refund and say forget about this mess but I'm thinking they won't refund music titles. If I get them replaced individually (and there's a lot) will the retailer keep replacing them until I get a decent press? This could be a long process especially after what I've just went through...Or will they just accept to refund my purchase price? I'm pretty upset $150.00 may not be a lot to you but it's a lot to me for such a poor product.

 

[Chris May]

Just a heads up to everyone here that is dealing with this issue with the vinyl - I contacted Matt D'Amico, VP of marketing at Universal earlier today, and here was his response:

Hey Chris,

I hope all is well. We are aware of the issue and are in the process of determining the exact batch that has been affected. This appears to be a plant manufacturing issue as you indicate. We have set up a customer service contact for the people who have received inferior product.

Consumers can send a proof of purchase to the e-mail below and a replacement LP will be sent to them - Email: [email protected]. There is also the following 1-800 phone number, but Customer Service prefers the e-mail address. Phone: 1-800-288-5942

If you could please relay the customer service information, that would be greatly appreciated and thank you for bringing this to my attention.

Thank you,

Matt

Hopefully this will help to rectify the situation.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Thanks Chris.

However, do I deal with my retailer who has already emailed me waiting for a response to how many LP's are affected OR do I contact UMG? I'm looking at about 6 of these are bad from my box set and the ones that visually look ok, I still have not had the chance to clean them or listen to see if there acceptable. Oh well...I guess it will work out somehow. Thanks for going the extra mile.