⭐ Official Review [Album] "KAREN CARPENTER" (SP-4804/CD-0588)
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Chris Mills
That was funny....like the dark vomited up
I've always listened to the unreleased songs from the solo sessions on my computer, but finally I've been able to listen to those unreleased tracks on my hi-fi. "Love Making Love To You" is a great arrangement and a real stand out track. I'm aware a lot of fans really dislike most of those unreleased songs, I'm just amazed at how Phil Ramone was able to take Karen's vocal abilities in another direction.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
That song should have made the album, it's amazing. The solo LP had 11 tracks as originally approved by Karen but I would have ended side A of the album with 'Remember When Lovin' Took All Night' and sandwiched this song between 'Still In Love With You' and 'My Body Keeps Changing My Mind' to round it out to an even 12 tracks. It's a blistering track and I'd love to know from someone like Itchie why it was binned off.
GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
Karen's album, or, rather all of the recorded songs for that album,
if marketed and sequenced properly, at that time, along with the
artwork/photos, had great potential.
I remain baffled as to the decision to cancel the album.
Not looking for a conspiracy, simply asking for reasoning.
Karen Carpenter--was she led to believe it was 'all systems go' for this album,
up until the time when the 'rug was pulled out from under her'--in an instant?
A year of arduous recording, travelling, high expectations...and, then,' bingo' --it's over, in an instant?
I do not understand the entire timeline from early 1979 to early 1980, the details...what really happened?
I mean, let's face it, not much to go on in the official Fan Club Newsletters.
Half a million dollars...explain this entire fiasco to me...it really does not make sense.
Quite frankly, my blood pressure increases every time I give it some thought.
Well, Thank God for the 1996 CD Karen Carpenter, and the later SHM-CD, and the lovely promo poster.
Unfortunately, Karen is not here to enjoy the attention it has deservedly garnered.
...free as a song, singing forever......
if marketed and sequenced properly, at that time, along with the
artwork/photos, had great potential.
I remain baffled as to the decision to cancel the album.
Not looking for a conspiracy, simply asking for reasoning.
Karen Carpenter--was she led to believe it was 'all systems go' for this album,
up until the time when the 'rug was pulled out from under her'--in an instant?
A year of arduous recording, travelling, high expectations...and, then,' bingo' --it's over, in an instant?
I do not understand the entire timeline from early 1979 to early 1980, the details...what really happened?
I mean, let's face it, not much to go on in the official Fan Club Newsletters.
Half a million dollars...explain this entire fiasco to me...it really does not make sense.
Quite frankly, my blood pressure increases every time I give it some thought.
Well, Thank God for the 1996 CD Karen Carpenter, and the later SHM-CD, and the lovely promo poster.
Unfortunately, Karen is not here to enjoy the attention it has deservedly garnered.
...free as a song, singing forever......
Then I suggest your blood pressure is a dangerous 708 over 111.
How do I arrive at that figure? Simply - you've made 111 of the 708 posts in this thread (not counting this one that makes 709), which gives you something between 15 and 16% of the posts here in this thread. And that doesn't count any of the posts you've made in other threads that mention the solo album.
Seriously Gary, you need to come to terms with the distant past (yes, distant - it was 35 years ago!). Take yourself back to when you were happily listening to the brand new song, "(They Long To Be) Close To You" in the summer of 1970. And then think about dwelling on something that had happened 35 years prior - in 1935.
(Just a fun exercise in the length of time here.)
All of this of course is to be taken lightheartedly, but with just a twinge of concern for your health and well-being. Maybe a
is in order. 
Harry
Chris Mills
That was funny....like the dark vomited up
Then I suggest your blood pressure is a dangerous 708 over 111.
How do I arrive at that figure? Simply - you've made 111 of the 708 posts in this thread (not counting this one that makes 709), which gives you something between 15 and 16% of the posts here in this thread. And that doesn't count any of the posts you've made in other threads that mention the solo album.
Seriously Gary, you need to come to terms with the distant past (yes, distant - it was 35 years ago!). Take yourself back to when you were happily listening to the brand new song, "(They Long To Be) Close To You" in the summer of 1970. And then think about dwelling on something that had happened 35 years prior - in 1935.
(Just a fun exercise in the length of time here.)
All of this of course is to be taken lightheartedly, but with just a twinge of concern for your health and well-being. Maybe a
Harry
708 posts! That's amazing for a project that almost didn't see the light of day. Thanks to Richard who listened to the fans and changed his mind.
I've already answered these questions several times in this thread,but will briefly explain again:
1.Albums get cancelled/shelved all the time and for many different reasons-this might be a big deal to some KC fans,but it's a normal & frequent occurrence in the music industry.Richard also had one of his solo albums shelved-and,likewise,several other A&M artists.
2.There's no such thing as "all systems go" while an album is being recorded.When an album is finished and delivered to the label-they give it either the green light or the red light.
3. There was more than one factor involved in the album's rejection.
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GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
Thank You, again, Mr. J,
Certainly the information you point out to me is well-tread, and well-read !
Certainly I understand exactly the three items you describe in your above posting,
and I appreciate the opportunity to read them, again ! Correct on all of your particulars:
(1) At the time (1979-1980) , was it a 'frequent' occurrence for an album by Carpenters' to get shelved ?
With the financial problems besetting the industry at that time (and, especially A&M Records)
---how could a year of recording and money be allocated--for a project destined to be 'shelved'?
("Karen was furious." Coleman,page 273)
(2) My understanding was that the "Green-Light" had been give to "initiate the project"---
not to end the project once delivered to the label.
("...At A&M the sales team had been whipped up into a state of fervor, the album had been designated a catalog number
and artwork was being prepared with fine new photographs." Coleman, page 276)
I had not realized Richard Carpenters' shelved album had gotten as far as " a catalog number".
(3) It is the "..more than one factor..." that I am attempting to understand.
I am, at least, in company with Carpenters' Legal Counselor,
Werner Wolfen :
"Had it been vetoed for wholly artistic and creative reasons, or
because Richard did not like the basic principle.?"(page 273, Coleman).
Certainly the information you point out to me is well-tread, and well-read !
Certainly I understand exactly the three items you describe in your above posting,
and I appreciate the opportunity to read them, again ! Correct on all of your particulars:
(1) At the time (1979-1980) , was it a 'frequent' occurrence for an album by Carpenters' to get shelved ?
With the financial problems besetting the industry at that time (and, especially A&M Records)
---how could a year of recording and money be allocated--for a project destined to be 'shelved'?
("Karen was furious." Coleman,page 273)
(2) My understanding was that the "Green-Light" had been give to "initiate the project"---
not to end the project once delivered to the label.
("...At A&M the sales team had been whipped up into a state of fervor, the album had been designated a catalog number
and artwork was being prepared with fine new photographs." Coleman, page 276)
I had not realized Richard Carpenters' shelved album had gotten as far as " a catalog number".
(3) It is the "..more than one factor..." that I am attempting to understand.
I am, at least, in company with Carpenters' Legal Counselor,
Werner Wolfen :
"Had it been vetoed for wholly artistic and creative reasons, or
because Richard did not like the basic principle.?"(page 273, Coleman).
byline
Well-Known Member
There's quite a bit of published material out there to bolster Mr. J's assertion that unreleased albums, even by well-established artists, are a fairly common occurrence in the music industry. Case in point: this Rolling Stone article on a book about unreleased albums. Wikipedia also has an extensive list. It seems to be (looking at this from the point of view of a record company executive who is judging this not necessarily from an artistic standpoint, but a financial one) a situation of "good money after bad."
GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
01/21/2005 USATODAY
Phil Ramone
Transcript:
You produced an album for the Karen Carpenter.
What is your favorite recollection of working with her?
Phil Ramone:
" I think the best part of the relationship was her incredible drive and passion for music.
Her perfectionism was also unique to work with.
I think she had one of the most wonderful voices to hear across a microphone."
Source:
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/community/chat/2001-03-21-ramone.htm
Phil Ramone
Transcript:
You produced an album for the Karen Carpenter.
What is your favorite recollection of working with her?
Phil Ramone:
" I think the best part of the relationship was her incredible drive and passion for music.
Her perfectionism was also unique to work with.
I think she had one of the most wonderful voices to hear across a microphone."
Source:
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/community/chat/2001-03-21-ramone.htm
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GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
And, this:
"Russell Javors’ dedication to music has earned him a rightfully deserved place as an Inductee in the 2014 class of The Long Island Music Hall of Fame.
Russell has worked with artists such as Karen Carpenter, Slash, Phoebe Snow, and Iggy Pop.
Two of Javors’ compositions appeared on Karen Carpenter’s solo album."
More:
http://www.limusichalloffame.org/project/russell-javors/
"Russell Javors’ dedication to music has earned him a rightfully deserved place as an Inductee in the 2014 class of The Long Island Music Hall of Fame.
Russell has worked with artists such as Karen Carpenter, Slash, Phoebe Snow, and Iggy Pop.
Two of Javors’ compositions appeared on Karen Carpenter’s solo album."
More:
http://www.limusichalloffame.org/project/russell-javors/
GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
A quick question for the experts:
In the 1996 Liner Notes (page 7) Phil Ramone states: "I have not remixed or done anything to the tapes."
However, on page 5 of the Booklet, roughly 10 lines down: "Remixed by Phil Ramone and Jim Boyer in M.E.S.M."
Can anyone elaborate upon this ?
In the 1996 Liner Notes (page 7) Phil Ramone states: "I have not remixed or done anything to the tapes."
However, on page 5 of the Booklet, roughly 10 lines down: "Remixed by Phil Ramone and Jim Boyer in M.E.S.M."
Can anyone elaborate upon this ?
Aaron Moyer
Member
Ramone did not have any idea how to select songs for Karen. Nothing is memorable and no other artist picked up on this sorry lot of songs. Karen made the most of this mediocre lot.
byline
Well-Known Member
I think some of the songs worked, but for me not all of them did ... and that's why her solo album falls flat (that's just my opinion). I was listening to Lovelines today and was struck at how good those four songs sounded in context with the other Carpenters songs. Richard chose the best ones, then moved Karen's voice more to the forefront of the mix. Somehow the audio quality of her solo album sounds a bit distant to me, but on Lovelines her voice regains its warmth and resonance on those solo tracks. I also think it's because for the most part, Karen didn't utilize her basement voice on the solo album. She did a bit, but because she was generally singing in a somewhat higher range than on most Carpenters albums (Made in America being a notable exception), it gave the overall sound a kind of homogeneity. Not stylistically, but sonically. Because Karen's solo tracks are intermingled with Carpenters tracks, there's more variety. As a result, the solo songs stand out to me more. "If I Had You" was her biggest triumph on the solo album, IMO. That one took some serious chops to pull off ... and Karen did.
newvillefan
I Know My First Name Is Stephen
I think as well as moving Karen's vocal more up front, he added reverb to her leads and to some of the instruments, notably the drums. The original mixes sound very dry to me.
GaryAlan
Well-Known Member
Oops...I can't resist another post regarding Karen Carpenter's solo....this, on
March 2nd, her Birthday....
Recalling:
Ramone's intent of....
" a stylistic change",
"...fresh territory of song and style",
"...reshape Karen in a new direction..." (Coleman, page 265)
Alpert's choice of...."a producer as provocative as the decision itself." (ibid.,page 264)
Bettis agrees (with Richard Carpenter)...."there was no Hit on the album...." (page 276)
But,
"Karen loved the record." (page 271)
and,
"...She returned to A&M with a surprise. She wanted to continue with the idea of a solo album, and asked if they would pick
some new songs for her. But it was not to happen." (ibid.,page 272).
Finally, and, again,
I agree with Karen Carpenter:
" ...that album is F.... great"
(Febrauary 3, 1983, ibid.,page 321).
March 2nd, her Birthday....
Recalling:
Ramone's intent of....
" a stylistic change",
"...fresh territory of song and style",
"...reshape Karen in a new direction..." (Coleman, page 265)
Alpert's choice of...."a producer as provocative as the decision itself." (ibid.,page 264)
Bettis agrees (with Richard Carpenter)...."there was no Hit on the album...." (page 276)
But,
"Karen loved the record." (page 271)
and,
"...She returned to A&M with a surprise. She wanted to continue with the idea of a solo album, and asked if they would pick
some new songs for her. But it was not to happen." (ibid.,page 272).
Finally, and, again,
I agree with Karen Carpenter:
" ...that album is F.... great"
(Febrauary 3, 1983, ibid.,page 321).
byline
Well-Known Member
IMO, of the songs that didn't make it onto the official solo album, this one is the best. I still can't fathom why it wasn't selected (unless it's because Karen felt it sounded too much like a standard Carpenters ballad). But for me, this song shows off her vocal and emotional range so much better than much of what was chosen for the solo album. I understand that Karen wanted to have fun, try out new sounds, etc. And I applaud that. But I also think she sort of "threw out the baby with the bathwater" by not showcasing her greatest strengths as a singer. I think that if this song had been included on the album, my opinion of it would have improved.
"Something's Missing" and "If We Try" are the best cuts from Karen's solo sessions-and,ironically,the two cuts that resemble a typical Carpenters recording.
Richard evidently wanted to finish "Something's Missing" for a compilation release in the mid/late 90's-but somehow wasn't able to get clearance from A&M.
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