SONG BY SONG: "KAREN CARPENTER" (SP-4804/CD-0588)

[GaryAlan]

This is from the RichardandKarenCarpenter official website:
"Out of the two recorded in 1982, only Now would have made any bona fide follow-up to "Made In America"."

 

[A&M Retro]

Thanks for the above reference, A&MRetro, as that Billboard article by Paul Grein is one
that I have never seen. But, I will peruse its content!
Another spectacular day when I learn something new!

My pleasure, GaryAllen!

 

[A&M Retro]

This is from the RichardandKarenCarpenter official website:
"Out of the two recorded in 1982, only Now would have made any bona fide follow-up to "Made In America"."

Yeah, R.C. ain't telling us all that went down. The article distinctly mentions that 'four sides were recorded' during the 1982 sessions.

 

[GaryAlan]

In the same vein, I seem to recall the list of "buried treasures" in the Japanese Mook.
And, since the publication of said Mook (1996), which I thought was "authorized" by Richard Carpenter, in
which he writes"....Chronological history of the Carpenters which focuses more on the recordings and career.."
and "..meant for Carpenters-philes and archivists.." ; that same list has since been invalidated for various (unknown) reasons.
Thus, that list, on page 80 of the Mook, (and, it being in the English language) was presumably proofread by Richard Carpenter
previous to publication. Why no translation of so much useful "archival" material to date?
Again, questions.
But, then again, thank God (and, Richard) that we do have the recordings that are available.

 

[mr J.]

Joe also played bass on both You're Enough and Now and since this was all one session, he probably also played on the other 2 as well. I bet this is the "session from hell" as he put it and this means there is another track or two with full leads from Karen. I wonder if Joe let this information slip out in error. I hate to think that her last recording session was the "session from hell".

Karen had a way about her and whatever may have been going on during any of her recordings....she never let it reflect in how her delivery performance came across. Solitaire and The Rainbow Connection are my all time favorites and Karen sings them like they are her favorites as well. Richard gave us Rainbow Connection however these other 2 we will likely never see if in fact they are from the "session from hell."

Mr J is quoted Here as saying that the last recording session could have filled a whole album....I was not aware that they recorded that much material. So there are more than just a few tracks.

There were at least four tracks recorded with Karen's lead,possibly five-and three of those were completed in April 1982.

Richard also recorded a few tracks with his lead vocal in May/June 1982.At least two of those were intended to be included on that planned 1982 album.

Four of these tracks were written by Richard & John Bettis(in 1982).

 

[GaryAlan]

Received my SHM-CD of Karen Carpenter, today.
Jeff (djn), let me thank you for spurring my interest in this release.
Your review of the SHM-CD was "spot on".
Is it me, or does it sound clearer, sharper?Artwork on cover is brighter,also.
The reviews of this particular japanese pressing were accurate, indeed.
Thanks to all.

 

[GaryAlan]

A&MRetro,
Is it possible for the above-mentioned interview, by Paul Grein, of Richard Carpenter to be scanned or posted?
I am not able to locate that issue of Billboard.
I can also locate no detailed information regarding the 1982 recording session(s).
Excepting the official Carpenter website (which says two songs), liner notes,
One Fan Club Newsletter(#74, April 1982- "Karen and Richard are laying tracks and have completed a few songs"),
I find virtually no details regarding the April 1982 recording session(s).
Where is this other information?

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Interesting article by Paul Grein about Karen's solo album.

The article is 2 pages, here is the link
http://articles.latimes.com/1989-11-07/entertainment/ca-918_1_karen-carpenter-album

Portion of article that I found interesting:

In an interview tied to the release of the new album, Richard Carpenter, 43, was candid about the conflicts within the Carpenters in the late '70s.

"Karen would mention every now and again that it would be nice to receive some accolades as a solo singer," he said in an A&M office in Hollywood. "Of course, that made me feel badly, because we were a duo. Lord knows, she was the star of the duo, but that's not quite the same."

Richard said that he had a less-than-supportive reaction to Karen's announcement--just after he had begun a six-week drug rehabilitation program--that she was planning to record an album without him.

"I probably said something like, 'You're just abandoning ship, just taking off and doing what you want to do.' I was feeling sorry for myself," he said. "It was a combination of feeling I was being abandoned--which was anything but the case looking back on it--and thinking this was a perfect time for her to get some treatment for her disorder. So I was not happy, and I told her as much."

Richard, who produced and arranged the Carpenters' long string of hits, also acknowledged that he felt threatened by Karen's teaming up with another producer.

"I'm human and it did cross my mind that something could come out of this and just explode at which time I would be going through a number of emotions. I'd be happy for Karen because I always felt that she should have been in the Top 5. On the other hand, being sensitive and feeling I'd done a good job for the Carpenters I would have been a little bit upset."

In a separate interview from his New York office, producer Phil Ramone discussed his and Karen's objective on the album. "We were thinking two things: How do we make a record that doesn't sound like the Carpenters, and what could we say lyrically in these songs that has a more mature attitude?"

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

I don't remember this article and here we clearly have Richard saying to Paul that he was scared that her solo album could "explode".....I always thought that Richard thought the album would not succeed commercially but here he says it crossed his mind that this could explode into something amazing for Karen.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Here is another interesting article about Karen's solo album

http://articles.latimes.com/1996-08-31/entertainment/ca-39226_1_karen-carpenter

I like this part of the article

"She was one of those amazing vocal talents--and a very interesting girl, a lot deeper than a lot of people gave her credit for," says eight-time Grammy winner Phil Ramone, who produced the record. "She was really at a phase in her life where I think she was facing womanhood and . . . needed to expand her horizons.

"Like anybody who comes out of a group, it was time for her to express herself as a vocalist, and also to show that . . . maturity was setting in. The goody-two-shoes thing, I think, was getting to be a problem for her. Not on a personal level, but career-wise."

 

[aaflyer98]

Just got KAREN CARPENTER shm-cd. Wow. Jeff, you and others were right on! These songs have a new life! The clarity, the nuances, just amazing. And that's just from my car stereo. At home, even better. Originally I had to grow to like "All Because Of You" but now, I really love it. The clarity and passage of time make this one of the stand out tracks. Also "Remember When Lovin' Took All Night" sounds incredible! Liberty Devito said it, this one really works! My very favorites from the beginning "My Body Keeps Changing My Mind", "If I Had You" and "Make Believe It's Your First Time" are crisp, crystal clear and beautiful. The track that stands out the most to me is "Making Love In The Afternoon". I always liked the song, but now I love it. Even the unmixed "Last One Singing The Blues" feels like we are in the studio with Karen, Phil and the band! You were right, Karen! This really was a f***ing great album!

 

[GaryAlan]

Karen sounds like she was having fun on this album.
It is great fun listening to this album and catching the subtle nuances in Karen's interpretation of these songs.
I've loved "My Body Keeps Changing My Mind" ever since first hear.
This album has become a favorite of mine, and (especially) with the SHM-CD release, Karen's vocals are crystal clear.
True, enough, certain songs are dated; but, "Karen is spreading her wings vocally" and she demonstrates
her incredible versatility with these tunes. That she is able to go from basement vocals to soaring high above the clouds,
is simply a joy to behold.
I used to not like "Still in Love With You", but it has grown on me, and the guitar solo is a nice touch.
That Karen even broached this song for recording is ample evidence that she was adventurous.
I do not feel that these songs could have been done better by any other vocalist.
An aside: In other interviews, Phil Ramone avoids using the above expletive (substituting 'damn').

 

[GaryAlan]

And, today, score another point for Karen Carpenter.
My 20 year-old niece, happened to catch me listening to "Making Love in the Afternoon".
She commented on how catchy this song was, and when I told her it was Karen, she was
impressed--That one and the same vocalist could tackle that song and "Superstar".
(previously she has only heard Carpenters "Superstar" , via Sonic Youth's take on the song,via Juno movie.)

 

[GaryAlan]

There is a "new" radio station in central Florida, Gold 99.7 FM,catering to "the oldies"--1960's and 1970's, for the most part.
In any event, my first observation: "Where in the H---" are the Carpenters? I have yet to hear them on this station.
Sorry folks, I just do not understand it.
Next up: They played Paul Simon's "Still Crazy After All These Years", last night.
My two cents, Karen Carpenter blows this song "out of the water" with her cover.
My God, what she did with that song ! Fantastic interpretation!
Enough Already, I still believe Karen Carpenter to be the most Fantastic interpreter of a (any) song.
Once again, those Karen Carpenter solo songs deserve to be heard by the wider public.
Almost everyone I speak with ( they not being Carpenters' fans, to be sure) has never heard of the Solo Album.

 

[mr J.]

There is a "new" radio station in central Florida, Gold 99.7 FM,catering to "the oldies"--1960's and 1970's, for the most part.
In any event, my first observation: "Where in the H---" are the Carpenters? I have yet to hear them on this station.
Sorry folks, I just do not understand it.
Next up: They played Paul Simon's "Still Crazy After All These Years", last night.
My two cents, Karen Carpenter blows this song "out of the water" with her cover.
My God, what she did with that song ! Fantastic interpretation!
Enough Already, I still believe Karen Carpenter to be the most Fantastic interpreter of a (any) song.
Once again, those Karen Carpenter solo songs deserve to be heard by the wider public.
Almost everyone I speak with ( they not being Carpenters' fans, to be sure) has never heard of the Solo Album.

You will very rarely hear K&R on an "oldies" station-they don't fit the oldies format.

K&R get good airplay on Tampa's WDUV("the duv"),a lite-FM station with a pretty good selection of 60's/70's/80's pop classics.

Generally speaking,K&R will only get airplay on an Easy Listening,Lite-FM or Jazz station.

 

[GaryAlan]

Yes, I realize that Karen and Richard, for whatever reason, have been pegged as Easy-Listening by the 'powers that be'.
And, Tampa's WDUV does play an occasional Carpenters' song.
But, even a cursory listen to the songs that are played; Well--how much more easy listening can you get? (e.g., James Taylor,
Bread, Anne Murray, Perry Como, Barbra Streisand (why doesn't she use Barbara?)....).
And, I could create a much more extensive list of artists.
Not only are the songs easy listening, but, in all honesty,
the arrangements on other "Easy-Listening" songs are so far beneath the Carpenters' arrangements--as to defy why the other
songs are played so often, especially in deference to great Carpenters' music.
Thus, I remain perplexed.
Perplexed that great music can be subsumed by inferior music, simply because of (mis)labeling the music.

 

[A&M Retro]

How are the Carpenters not an 'oldies' act? They had 28 Top 100 singles and 12 Top 10's between 1970 and 1983. They Are The Biggest American Chart Act Of The 1970s! That alone should give them recognition on oldies radio. The only thing that doesn't 'fit' for the oldies radio programmers is their image. Granted, it's probably too mellow for listeners on limited oldies lists. Those 'testing services' are taken far too seriously.

Also, it's important to remember that many listeners today aren't old enough to have heard them the first time around. Such a narrow vision these days, which does these artists a great disservice. But the same can be said for alternative and rock stations, who do the same thing with their limited formatting.

To be fair, Chicago's oldies stations have 'all '70's Sundays', and Carpenters DO get played on that day only.

 

[mr J.]

How are the Carpenters not an 'oldies' act? They had 28 Top 100 singles and 12 Top 10's between 1970 and 1983. They Are The Biggest American Chart Act Of The 1970s! That alone should give them recognition on oldies radio. The only thing that doesn't 'fit' for the oldies radio programmers is their image. Granted, it's probably too mellow for listeners on limited oldies lists. Those 'testing services' are taken far too seriously.

Also, it's important to remember that many listeners today aren't old enough to have heard them the first time around. Such a narrow vision these days, which does these artists a great disservice. But the same can be said for alternative and rock stations, who do the same thing with their limited formatting.

To be fair, Chicago's oldies stations have 'all '70's Sundays', and Carpenters DO get played on that day only.

Generally speaking,"oldies" is a term for pop-rock,classic rock and R&B from the 50's/60's/70's.

Classic Pop/Easy-Listening & Jazz is not considered "oldies".

If we were to use your definition of the term-then Frank Sinatra & Barbra Streisand would be considered "Oldies".

 

[mr J.]

Yes, I realize that Karen and Richard, for whatever reason, have been pegged as Easy-Listening by the 'powers that be'.
And, Tampa's WDUV does play an occasional Carpenters' song.
But, even a cursory listen to the songs that are played; Well--how much more easy listening can you get? (e.g., James Taylor,
Bread, Anne Murray, Perry Como, Barbra Streisand (why doesn't she use Barbara?)....).
And, I could create a much more extensive list of artists.
Not only are the songs easy listening, but, in all honesty,
the arrangements on other "Easy-Listening" songs are so far beneath the Carpenters' arrangements--as to defy why the other
songs are played so often, especially in deference to great Carpenters' music.
Thus, I remain perplexed.
Perplexed that great music can be subsumed by inferior music, simply because of (mis)labeling the music.

I was living in Tampa during 2012-and K&R got very good airplay on WDUV.

"We've Only Just Begun","For All We Know","Rainy Days" and "Solitaire" were played on a regular rotation.They also played "Superstar" and "It's Going to Take Some Time".

 

[A&M Retro]

Not sure what you mean by 'my term for oldies', but Carpenters were a very regular part of 'oldies' formats until the early '90s, when they were suddenly banished from the airwaves. Literally overnight. So much attention is being paid to testing services today. That being said, I still hear Jim Croce on oldies stations, and 'Time In A Bottle' certainly doesn't fall in the safe category of rock and roll.

 

[Harry]

It has to do with perception. No, "Time In A Bottle" is not what one would consider an "Oldies" record - but Jim Croce's work included some fairly rock'n'roll-ish hits like "Bad, Bad Leroy Brown" and "You Don't Mess Around With Jim". Those DO fit the definition of "Oldies" records.

Carpenters have always been perceived as "soft rock" since the majority of their hits are in that vein. No, it's not fair that you can still hear The Mamas and The Papas on Oldies stations and not Carpenters, but that's the way of the world.

Harry

 

[GaryAlan]

Yes, at some juncture in time, Carpenters' music did take a nose-dive on the "oldies"- (or, any)- radio stations.
I can recall Calling Occupants being played in Ocala, Florida around 1987-1989.
Also, in Central Florida Honolulu City Lights got some airplay (The single, 1986).
MTV had given a good bit of airplay to Sonic Youth's Superstar (1994); And,
I recall, If I Had You (1989) getting radio play in the 'heartland' (I was traveling, at the time).
Thus, I did hear Carpenters regularly on the radio throughout the mid to late 1980's.
Given Billboard's recent (2013) ranking of Carpenters as #32 ( of the Top 100 Artists from 1955-),
it makes NO sense whatsoever, that, for instance,(here,an arbitrary selection): Barry Manilow (#62),Kenny Rogers (#38),
Gloria Estefan (#49) or Captain&Tennille(#96) should receive significantly greater airplay.
I am not making a judgement regarding whether,or not, I like those artists...I am simply going "by the numbers".
Given Carpenters' impact on the landscape of American music, their songs are vastly under-represented on the airwaves.
Again, I am simply presenting my opinion based on the indelible numbers ( as actuated by Billboard).
Were I to base my opinion on actual musical talent, well, I would be even more disgusted.

 

[A&M Retro]

Understood, Harry. I still feel 'Superstar' and 'Hurting Each Other', at the very least, should be played on standard 'oldies' stations. Both of them 'rock' pretty well, and they're just as rocky as any of Jim Croce's tunes. He was great, by the way.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

On another note, Billboard's Paul Grein interviewed Richard in October, 1983, as part of the promotional push for 'Voice of the Heart'. Richard states that there were four tracks recorded in April, 1982 ('You're Enough', 'Now' and two others). It's likely one of those unreleased tracks is the one she strongly disliked.

There are purportedly others that feature Richard's lead which were recorded around the same time. Not sure if that was just to get a 'feel' for a song he had planned ahead for Karen to sing or not. I would bet he sang lead on a few of them while she was away in NYC.

Sorry for quoting an old post but I saw this article on Billboard Magazine Sept 21, 1996 page 41 that talks about the song from Karen's solo album, "Remember When Lovin Took All Night" I'm not sure if this link will work but if it does scroll to page 41.

http://books.google.com/books?id=wwkEAAAAMBAJ&printsec=frontcover&lr=&rview=1#v=onepage&q&f=false
I'm going to quote the article here:

LONG HOLD: A self titled A&M album featuring the late Karen Carpenter already released in Europe and due in the US Oct 8, 1996 features a 17 year old song by Molly-Ann Leikin and John Farrar. Leikin's publisher Mike Stewart of Interworld had agreed to give Carpenter the first crack at it, in the music publishing parlance, it was "put on hold."
Leikin says Carpenter recorded the song 4 years after it was written. In fact she adds that the session took place only a few days before Carpenter died in 1983 of anorexia nervosa. The song, Remember When Lovin Took All Night, is an uptempo number which is unusual for Leikin who is essentially a ballad writer. I couldn't write an uptempo song to save my life but with John as co writer he was the hottest producer at the time it amazingly came off, she says. Ironically, Leikin was mad that a ballad singer like Carpenter was recording the song, she says, but now she feels honored that her rendition is finally being released. I guess if you wait long enough it all comes around.

END

So I was trying to figure out when this song was written, the article says it's a 17 year old song so this article was written in 1996 so that would mean the song was written in 1979, then the article says Karen recorded it 4 years after it was written that would make it 1983. Something doesn't make sense. Was Karen still working on her solo album in 1983 prior to her death? or was this song recorded in one of her last recording sessions in 82?

Then I was thinking if this article is a misprint, we know she recorded her solo album in 79 and 4 yrs before then the song had to be written in 1975, but the lyrics and song don't sound like something that would have been written in 1975.

 

[newvillefan]

So I was trying to figure out when this song was written, the article says it's a 17 year old song so this article was written in 1996 so that would mean the song was written in 1979, then the article says Karen recorded it 4 years after it was written that would make it 1983. Something doesn't make sense. Was Karen still working on her solo album in 1983 prior to her death? or was this song recorded in one of her last recording sessions in 82?

Then I was thinking if this article is a misprint, we know she recorded her solo album in 79 and 4 yrs before then the song had to be written in 1975, but the lyrics and song don't sound like something that would have been written in 1975.

I'd say it's either the latter of the above or her recollection of the timing is way off. The track was recorded as part of the original solo sessions and was one of the 11 songs delivered to A&M in 1980 (and Phil Ramone later said in 1996 on the liner notes that the tracklist was as Karen had approved it in 1980). There's no way she was working on this track in 1983 or even in 1982. It's got Phil Ramone's stamp all over it and she, Phil and the entire solo project 'band' parted company when the album was shelved in 1980. If you look at the musician (and producer) credits on the 'Lovelines' album, this track was firmly part of the solo sessions.