Tunes ruined by strings

[Vinylalbumcovers]

Okay, Richard is an arranger; I get it. Still, I have to wonder if every tune needed a string arrangement. Case in point: "Want You Back In My Life". The arrangement is synth pop albeit with real drums and bass guitar. Why did he add strings? They age the tune about 30 years and they just don't fit.

Any others you can think of that just didn't need strings?

Ed

P.S.: Notice I haven't said a word about the oboe...

 

[A&M Retro]

LOL>> Good post. A friend of mine always says, 'Cue the oboes!' when I make him listen to Carpenters.

The one song that really sounds over-produced to me is 'Ordinary Fool'. The arrangement is too Lawrence Welk for my taste. All that was really needed was Karen's voice, bass, piano, drums and sax. "When You've Got What It Takes" also springs to mind. Just so over-orchestrated.

 

[Vinylalbumcovers]

I don't mind all of the strings on "Ordinary Fool". I do think they're far too big most of the time. To my ears, he just went too far on that one. As time went on, he seemed far too concerned with trying to prove his worth to Carpenters brand. As a result, he overdid it a time or twelve.

Ed

 

[A&M Retro]

So true, Ed! I always thought 'Made In America' was Richard's 'big statement' as a producer. Virtually everything on that album is produced to the HILT. And the first thing I noticed when playing that album in 1981 was how low Karen's leads were mixed on that album. Richard always said in interviews prior to 1981 how the lead vocal should be very UP in the mix, and he did the opposite on MIA.

Furthermore, she didn't get an 'Associate Producer' credit on that album....for the first time since 1973. Makes you wonder how much Karen's solo venture from the year before had to do with those decisions.

 

[Mark-T]

"I always thought 'Made In America' was Richard's 'big statement' as a producer. Virtually everything on that album is produced to the HILT. And the first thing I noticed when playing that album in 1981 was how low Karen's leads were mixed on that album. Richard always said in interviews prior to 1981 how the lead vocal should be very UP in the mix, and he did the opposite on MIA."

Totally agree- I really like much of the album but hate how "muted" Karen sounds.

 

[Vinylalbumcovers]

MIA is the ultimate in "safe" to my ears. There's very little that moves me at all. "Touch Me..." is very nice but, again, killed by strings. It likely would have charted even higher without them. They weren't necessary in the least bit and they give the tune an "elevator" sheen that's incredibly unattractive. Most tunes on the record are incredibly over-produced. Strings and horns could be removed from "Strength Of A Woman" (frankly, the lyrics could go out with them but that's another issue...LOL!) and it'd still be a decent tune. There are strings, horns, and the kitchen sink on every tune and Karen is "doubled" on everything just so that her voice cuts through it all. Karen's solo record took a lot of chances - a few of them really bad (the Javors tunes). MIA barely inches forward at all and when it does, Richard seemingly uses the strings to pull it back into "elevator" territory.

Ed

 

[A&M Retro]

I loved the first four tunes on MIA, plus 'Touch Me When We're Dancing', and even 'Beechwood'. But the other tracks were a little too soft for my 19 year old ears. Still feel the same today.

I will always maintain that 'Back In My Life Again' was an excellent record (especially in 1981), but Karen's vocals were just too buried in the mix. I was waiting for that song to take off. I heard it three or four times on the radio, and that was it.

I've mentioned this in another post, but I still remember a DJ playing it, and at the end, saying, 'That's the Carpenters. A nice little twist for them!'

 

[aaflyer98]

Thanks for this topic.
To me, "Where do I Go From Here" is a great pop song,as recorded, until the strings get too heavy. They could have been much lighter. Then the moment that ruins it for me is the final notes of the song the strings do this lush ending. Nope. It's a song about broken hearts, c'mon. My opinion only, and I still love the song, Just hate the strings.

 

[jfiedler17]

Totally agreed with everyone here that the strings really detracted significantly from MIA.
As a set of songs, I think there's a lot of great songwriting on that record, but the production on that record is fairly disappointing. Take away the strings and some of the more unnecessary overdubs and free up more space in the mix for Karen's vocals to breathe, and I think "Touch Me ..." and "Back in My Life Again" could have been much, much bigger hits. "Back in My Life" is actually a much more amazing song than you can tell through the production (for one thing, it's just non-stop hooks from start to finish; easily the catchiest of all their post-Passage singles, for sure), but Karen's vocals are just so buried and the production just so overly lush (no thanks to the strings) that it makes elevator music out of what is, in actuality, a very contemporary-sounding song that might have otherwise fit effortlessly on the radio alongside the other adult-pop of the time.
Which is one of the strangest things to me about MIA, because so many other of their soft-rock peers from the '70s at this same time were running away from the more lush elements of their sound to try something just a little more modern-sounding (look at some of the stuff Barry Manilow or Melissa Manchester were doing around the same time, for instance), whereas Richard & Karen did have a bunch of very contemporary-sounding songs on hand (like the two singles) but just produced them in a way that made them sound much too lush and then, on top of it all, surrounded them with songs (i.e. "Those Good Old Dreams," "Beechwood 4-5789") that were terribly unlikely to change the opinions of anyone who considered the group too nostalgic. (I'm not sure the packaging helped, either, but that's another thread ...) I'm not sure what really caused them to take such a huge step back - whether it was the modest sales of the more adventurous Passage, Richard's negative reaction to Karen's solo album, etc. - but whatever the reason, I think it was too big an overreaction.
It'd be quite interesting to hear this album Let It Be ... Naked-style without all the strings and excessive overdubs. I'm sure I'd enjoy it a lot more, 'cause, like I said, there's certainly some great songwriting on there!

- Jeff