Wechter question

[alpertfan]

This question makes me wish I was here when Mr. Julius Wechter visited the forum before his untimely passing-Does anyone know why he was unaccredited on the albums recorded by the original TJB, but is credited as an official member of the Reorganized lineup? Did he or Mr. Alpert want it that way? I know of course, that the second incarnation of the group was with some new members, but since Wechter was in both lineups, why did he get credit for one and not the other?

 

[Rudy]

Weeelllllll...tough question.

For one, we know both Herb and Julius had their own "things" going with the BMB and TJB. Also, we know that many TJB albums did not feature some of the musicians in the public (or "touring") lineup. Tonni Kalash, for one, was not featured on a TJB album to the best of my knowledge.

One reason was that they likely wanted to keep the two group identities separate. With touring, too, people may come to expect Julius to be in the band if he played on an album. With his own BMB doing its own tour schedule and making appearances, there could have been some conflicts.

But that also brings up a question that only Julius or Herb could answer: why didn't Julius just become a TJB member, and never form the BMB in the first place? That certainly could have been an early possibility!

Musician credits on the actual album jackets didn't become a requirement until a union ruling (musician's union?) changed that. I believe that happened at some point in the early 70's.

 

[Jay Maynes/Juan Oskar]

"Musician credits on the actual album jackets didn't become a requirement until a union ruling (musician's union?) changed that."

In that era it seems that almost no one had credits on the albums. I remember the story the "Wrecking Crew" in one studio when the "Monkees" were in another with the media. If fans would have known that it was the studio guys doing for all these different bands it would have blown their image. Later...Jay

 

[martin]

I guess we should assume that the TJB musicians were featured on most albums after Going Places and that other players were added as the arrangements would require it. Julius would be a regular as the marimba was an integral part of the TJB sound on all of the albums. The possible exception would be Tonni Kalash, but on the other hand, as I understand it, the TJB was a full time engagement for the members from 1966 to 69 and it does not really make sense not to make use of all of them on the recordings. The arrangements were to be played live by them, anyway on the upcoming tours. On the back of the NINTH cover, the whole band is listed as "featured". Do we know for sure that Tonni Kalash never played on any TJB album?

- greetings from the sunny north -
Martin

 

[Steven J. Gross]

Julius was very humble, I think it was the sounds that mattered to him- not the glory so much.

 

[DAN BOLTON]

I imagine it was probably a marketing decision...there was room for another "Ameriachi" group besides the TJB in the marketplace...and if Julius woud have been performing with the TJB, there wouldn't have been nearly as many opportunities for him to hone his songwriting craft. Also, he wouldn't have had nearly as many chances to display his performing skills, both musical and theatrical. Artistically, it made much better sense to have two groups, and if Julius were credited on the TJB albums, everyone would have expected for him to tour.


And, just between you and me, how difficult is it to recognize that that's him on the marimba on all the TJB records, anyway?


Dan

 

[Clark]

I think we are losing site of the real reason behind the various moves at A&M Records in 1965 and 1966. In 1965, the Brass had a smash hit in "A Taste of Honey" At that point, it was still a studio band, but by the end of that year, there was enough interest in the band that they started making TV appearances, and a touring group was put together. At the same time, the BMB had put out several albums, also as studio musicians, and while not as successful as the TJB, they brought in enough to warrent furher albums. IMHO, Julius was not a part of the original Brass touring group because he was deemed more valuable to A&M Records as the leader of the BMB. IT WAS ALL ABOUT MONEY!!!! Two bands selling records was better than one. In mid to late 1966, BMB had a hit with "Ghost Riders in the Sky" and A&M had three hot albums, "What Now My Love", "Watch Out" and "SRO" BMB followed the lead of the Brass and formed a very entertaining touring group and began making appearances. Just as Herb could help with arrangements on the BMB albums, he also featured many of Julius' songs on Brass albums. I think it must have been a very profitable collaboration for both men and for A&M. No need to worry about credits when the pocket book is full.

 

[Captaindave]

I have read an interview with former TJB member Pat Senatore which states that, for the most part, Herb Alpert played all the trumpet parts on the TJB recordings. He does not recall Tonni Kalash being used in the recording studio.

This makes sense to me because, in listening to the recordings, there is a virtually perfect blend of tone and phrasing - as might be expected when one person is doing all the playing.

I used to think that perhaps Tonni Kalash might have played in the studio, but that is even further in doubt when it is considered that Herb is said to have layered or "stacked" the trumpet several times and detuned the trumpet a little each time to get the sound he wanted. This indicates that one person is overdubbing the parts several times.
This can also be found in the Pat Senatore interview I mentioned above and in an interview with Herb in Windplayer magazine in 1986.