Recurrent themes....

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Tony

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How many of the Carpenters' albums had songs with recurrent themes? For example, Horizon had at least three songs with references to cards that I can think of off the top of my head:

Solitaire - obviously.
Happy - "...you can deal me in this time around...".
Desperado - "...the Queen of Hearts is always your best bet".

(Please Mr. Postman's line about a "card or a letter" doesn't count 'cause it refers to a greeting card, not a playing card.)

Can you guys think of any other such recurring themes that seem to be intentional?

Tony
 
TONY--You must be bored! (just kiddin) But its something i never taken into consideration. Sure there are themes. Look at How Richard Bookended Horizon with Eventide and Aurora. If you Look at their first album, Ticket to ride..Its sorta has some rock influences. Richard himself said he was going through an anti establishment towards easy listening, to which theyd become! Passage has upbeat tracks for the most part and something wed not find in the other carpenters albums and Made In america is a very sophistaced arranging of songs on one album. They are very classy in a way but yet very modern. So to say theres trends in lyrics, well maybe. But not whats in the song lyrics. But I understand. Its cool how you associated the Cards and Games together on the Horizon CD. If you take that album, Horizon.. It is formatted to sound like a very emotional album, with some of Karens greatest Vocals! But If you know one thing as Karen and Rich said in an 1975 interview, Horizon was very exhausting for them. They were in the studio way up past copable hours. I expect how Karen and Richard are feeling, alters the themes in their songs. Richard commented on the tracks of Horizon as "Darggy" and he said he was feeling Draggy. Im sorry if im rambling, But with what you said about the themes and the similairities in the whole album by itself, Its kinda cool to figure.

Maybe someone else can come up with a better answer for ya tony! I cant examine the lyrics in my head at this time. Its 12:19 am.. Hoppe anything i typed gave you any insight

Michael
 
Thanks Mike. I'm not really referring to musical themes such as bookending. I'm thinking instead about lyrical themes (other than the obvious one: Love) that recur either in individual albums or across more than one. And it's not because I'm bored, but because I think it's an interesting insight into R & K's creative process. Being a writer, I suppose I'm inclined to look for things like this.

Without trying too hard, I can see at least two more lyrical themes like the one I mentioned previously and I was just curious if anyone out there noticed any as well.

T.
 
I believe "Voice of the Heart" falls into this category.
I'll have to rely on my (faltering) memory for lyrics, but the theme I see is "dreams".

"Look to your Dreams"- natch
"Ordinary Fool"- "when his ordinary dreams fall through"
"You're Enough" - "made for wishers, made for dreamers", "sweetest dreams come true"
"Two Lives"- "Maybe I'm a dreamer maybe just a fool"
"Your Baby"- "next to your broken dreams"

Somehow, I was thinking "Made in America" had a similar theme, but off the top of my head, I couldn't recall.

Mark
 
Mark,

Bingo! That's one that I noticed as well. There's another theme that I've noticed, or perhaps a motif would be a better term, that the C's return to in one fashion or another on several albums. I'll wait and see if anyone else notices it.

And Mike, I disagree that it's a coincidence. I think things like this occur with some degree of planning.

Tony
 
There is an obvious theme about cars in some songs.

Bwanna She No Home-Drive my 350 hunny, don't let um steal my crome
Johnny Angel-car crashing
others from Now & Then-her daddy's car & she cruise through the hamburger stand now.

I'm sure there are other car themes too in a few others I'm missing.
 
I think the Offering album was aptly named. Besides the bookends "Invocation" and "Benediction," many of the songs are about offering or being offered something--or having nothing at all to offer, in the case of "Nowadays Clancy Can't Even Sing." "Someday" explicitly says 'all I can offer is someday.' "Eve" is offered an opinion about her life, then wishes for 'only good times.' There's an offer to "Get Together." Other songs offer advice and opinions about squares ("Your Wonderful Parade"), smugness ("Turn Away"), loving ("Don't Be Afraid"), and work ("What's The Use"). Perhaps "All Of My Life" or "All I Can Do" is an offer of some sort, too. If there is a discernible theme, I don't believe it was either coincidental or intentional. Maybe subconscious, like a mindset at work behind the selection of which tunes to put or not put on their album.

Chris makes a good point about those cars. The oldies medley on Now & Then, for example, has one wrecking and another being taken away; and I think "Heather" makes a good driving tune for traveling down the interstate. But I suppose that doesn't count. :)

The horizon/sky theme also seems prevalent on Horizon. I'd be very hard pressed to try to figure out what the possible theme for Passage is.


...anteing up MHO, online
 
Well Now i do see Tony's point. The theme of cards and games, well it had to do with love and the obstacles tearing it apart. "If you're only using me to feed your fantasy, then its not really love, so let me go, i must be free" that there can be interrupted as some games and immaturity a man may take and lose his love. Happy is the flip side. its about getting past the games and getting it right. and as far as "Im caught between goodbye and I love you" well with all the games, shes gotta be confused to stay or not. So all in all the theme for Horizon is..stay in love, or break up? Horizon really is an emotional peace of work. During the horizon sessions Karens vocal chords were scratchy and maybe she sounded even more so "Rangy" she does sound a little dry here. but thats not a bad thing!

Mike

and their moods during this mid career peice does show through in some themes.
 
OK, how about the fondness that the C's seemed to have for sailing and the ocean? It began with the covers of Ticket to Ride and Close to You. There have were several songs that mentioned the ocean (or the sea) in the lyrics, including "Maybe it's You" and "Caught Between Goodbye and I Love You". Then you have the sailing songs such as "Boat to Sail", "All You Get From Love..." and "Sailing on the Tide".

Tony
 
Mike,

Exactly, and well-said. Several of the songs on Horizon used card games (solitaire, poker) as a metaphor for the game of love, and this metaphor was repeated several times. It was clearly no accident.

Tony
 
As Far as Passage Goes, I doubt theres a theme. I mean Richard wasnt nearly involved in this project as ones past. The reason why Horizon has such a big theme is that a lot of teh material was written by Richard and John! they must have been going through a draggy time. Passage is Karen and Richards experimental project. They wanted to try to crack top 40..what made top 40 a lot of times Karen and Richard found out was to make a 3 minute record. and Out comes "Sweet Sweet Smile" Though I do love Passage it dosnt seem to be going in one particular direction, hint lack of theme. Richard is stated as having an eclectic range of music and he wanted to offer more here. I do love the jazzy "B wanna she no home. defintely a plus.

Mike

P.S. By the way Tony, I was thinking of posting a topic on the evolutionary style and themes of the carpenters. This answers some of the styles and trends i have been thinking of. Thanks!
 
Right Tony, the ocean & sailing is evident, don't forget about..... Rising on the Shore the OceanKing, walks along the waves of velveteen... :D

edit: Oh I see you did say Maybe it's You, sorry
 
I can't believe no one has listed two recurrent themes all through Carpenters' music:

YOU and YESTERDAY

You, If I Had You, Your The One, Your Enough, I Have You...etc.

Yesterday Once More, Only Yesterday, Leave Yesterday Behind...etc.

Just my thoughts.
 
Tony said:
Please Mr. Postman's line about a "card or a letter" doesn't count 'cause it refers to a greeting card, not a playing card.

Tony
Click to expand...

Yes, but the "chance" of it "being in your bag for me" seems to have a reference to one theme--Chance.

That is, "being lucky in love", I think nearly ALL of The Carpenters' body of work is about, INMO, anyway... :winkgrin:

Dave

...stating "the most re-ocurring theme of all"?... :o
 
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